Who plays the Kisaeng lady?

[Guest]

thebo said:

Hey, guest, you'd better be careful (LOL). We had a huge argument on the Dae Jang Geum board a while back about what exactly a kisaeng was. People got angry. ;D

In any case, since many courtesans were taught to read, sing and recite poetry in order to entertain their customers or masters, it sometimes happened that they became well-known, respected poets themselves. This must be what occurred with the character of Chung-hyang. There was an 18th century Vietnamese poet courtesan named Ho Xuan Hong (called "Spring Essence" and translated in 2000 by John Balaban), for instance, whose poetry was widely known, admired and imitated by the literati of that country.

Bo

Hey, TheBo, I never insinuated or attempted to imply that a girl like this fictional character, Chung Hyang, could never rise to the status depicted on this show. I tried to keep my description of the Kisaeng as dry and non-nuanced as possible, though perhaps that is a fault--perhaps I should have been nuanced.

Haha. I didn't think that anyone would find my description of the Kisaeng to be insulting to the Kisaeng or to any member of this board. But I thank you, TheBo, for this warning. I shall heed your words and promptly proceed to protect myself from the wraths of others. ;D

I would like it to be known on this board that I am a big fan of the shijo-lyrics of the 16th century Kisaeng, Hwang Chini. Mostly what I know about the Kisaeng comes from the little I know about this popular figure of Korean history. I love Hwang Chini . . . so please don't hit me. Hahaha. ;D

[TheBo]

Yes, do protect your head and shoulders from the missles of the disgruntled, guest! ;D I myself have a few bruises of combat.

Are you joking about Hwang Chini? Was she a poet? Do you know if any of her work has been translated to English (that least subtle of all languages)?

The poetry of Ho Xuan Hong was hard to translate for Mr Balaban. It is full of puns and layers of meaning unreachable to translation, especially since it was written in the old language of Vietnam, "Nom," which is not even spoken in that country any more and was especially susceptible to punning. But he did a wonderful job with the book. I recommend it.

Bo

[Guest]

thebo said:

Yes, do protect your head and shoulders from the missles of the disgruntled, guest! ;D I myself have a few bruises of combat.

;D

thebo said:

Are you joking about Hwang Chini? Was she a poet?

Hwang Chini (or Jin-i) is not my invention; I am not clever enough with words to invent someone of her poetic accomplishments. She is said to have been a very beautiful woman and an accomplished Kisaeng. I don't know how it is now, since I was schooled in America, but when my dad was a young student in Korea, memorization of her best poems were compulsory.

thebo said:

Do you know if any of her work has been translated to English (that least subtle of all languages)?

The poetry of Ho Xuan Hong was hard to translate for Mr Balaban. It is full of puns and layers of meaning unreachable to translation, especially since it was written in the old language of Vietnam, "Nom," which is not even spoken in that country any more and was especially susceptible to punning. But he did a wonderful job with the book. I recommend it.

Bo

Thank you for the recommendation. I love good poetry and I will definitely try to track this down.

But I am sorry to hear that English is not subtle enough for you. I won't defend the language here, but I'll just say that it suits me fine. ;D But I guess if you really like to see aggressive use of puns in your English language poetry, you're pretty much stuck with Shakespeare--he is the only one who seems to have thought that puns are a poetic necessity. But I'm sure you already know this. ;D

There are some poems of Hwang Chini's that have made it to into the English language. But I don't think there is a translated book of just her work. I think that if you want to track her down in the English language, you are going to have to hit the anthologies section. I am sorry that I cannot recommend any one book because I haven't read much of her translated. So I can't tell you which translator has done a good job of annotating what has been lost in the act of translating. For myself, I just happened to encounter her here and there over the years, always delighting in what I find.

Here's a link to Wikipedia's description of the Shijo form:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sijo

Here's Amazon.com's Sijo anthologies listing:
Sijo Amazon

Here's another book:
www.hup.harvard.edu/contents/OROBOO_toc.html

Here's a well-respected book by an American which describes the history of early Korean literature; it has a section called "Shijo" ascribed to "Kisaeng":
www.columbia.edu/cu/cup/catalog/data/023111/0231119461.HTM

And here's where you can find one of her most popular poems written in Korean, and underneath, translated into the English:
www.koreasociety.org/KS_curriculum/HS/2/2-text/2_141_2.htm

And here, an Amazon customer gives a translation of another of Hwang Chini's most popular poems, though I don't like this translation very much:
www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0030120713/103-0055544-0185406?v=glance

I apologize for letting this post get long.

Take care. ;D

[evil moderator Bo changed link to shorten hah hah hah]

[Guest]

Here's Amazon.com's Sijo anthologies listing:
Sijo


Hmm. I guess you are just going to have to cut and paste this address: it's too long.

;D

[chigirl68]

I hope you don't mind that I modified your post guest. Just so the link is not sooooo looonnnggg...

[Trespasser]

whose fearsome look could "kill a man."

Unskilled unionized Baggage handlers at American Airlines, UPS package handlers, and Jewel Grocery Store baggers make way more than $500 a week.

Well, you see two episodes per week, not one, so that means YSS actor is paid $1,000 a week. That's a lot more than what he used to make as nobody.

Typical TV Actor's Salary

Extras : $40/day(If the shoot extends past 12 hours, then it is counted as 2-days) (All those extras)
Contracted Actors : $300~3,000 per episode, depending on the duration of acting career. (All the regulars including YSS actor)
Free Agents : Whatever is agreed on the contract.(Won Gyun and Mijin/Chohee actors)

But Mr. Kim Myung Min is too old to rise up to the rank of highly paid actors; that is reserved to those 20-something "pretty boys", who can sell a show to Japanese or Chinese markets.

[Guest]

chigirl68 said:

I hope you don't mind that I modified your post guest. Just so the link is not sooooo looonnnggg...

Whoa

How dare you make it more convenient for others to follow the link. Evil, evil moderator. ;D

[Guest]

Trespasser said:

Well, you see two episodes per week, not one, so that means YSS actor is paid $1,000 a week. That's a lot more than what he used to make as nobody.

But Mr. Kim Myung Min is too old to rise up to the rank of highly paid actors; that is reserved to those 20-something "pretty boys", who can sell a show to Japanese or Chinese markets.

Hmm, 100 episodes or so . . . about $50,000 before tax for a couple months worth of shooting . . . that's not bad I guess.

Well, according to Koreanwiz.org, he's only 32, almost 33. And he's very talented. I'll be rooting for him to get his pay raised, especially now since I learned from this year's Mercer Human Resource Consulting (MHRC) survey that Seoul is currently the fifth most expensive city in the world to live in. ;D

[Guest]

Trespasser said:

Haha. Ok, I am convinced. But tell me his name, Trespasser. I do not know this movie or this actor. ;D

[Heather]

But Mr. Kim Myung Min is too old to rise up to the rank of highly paid actors;

What Cinema Service, one of the largest film distributors in Korea, had to say regarding actor Kim Myeong Min back in 2003 after his role in the film Into the Mirror:

"Pay him attention, without fail, his eye-catching acting and masculine charm will live up to expectations.

The filmography of Kim Myeong Min is short. It consists of the 2001 film Sorum and Kim Seong Hong's film Stunt Man, which has not yet been released. However, film industry people no longer think of him as a newcomer. Called 'the star of the next generation', he is one of the hottest actors in Korea. His first impression in Sorum, the debut film by Yoon Jong Chan, was so impressive and solid that rather than thinking of him as a new actor, people look to the diverse future roles he will play with expectation. The certainty that people feel of his abilities, despite having seen him in only one film so far, stems from the long and dedicated effort he has devoted to becoming a film actor.

"After being discovered in a 1996 SBS talent contest, he accumulated vast experience in a large number of small and supporting roles. After roles in the TV dramas Turn Back Your Angry Face and Some Like It Hot (in which he worked together with actor Yu Oh Seong) he made a name for himself and eventually debuted in 2001 with Sorum. In 2002 he acted with Jo Jae Hyun in Stunt Man, and now in 2003 he joins Yu Ji Tae as an equal in the film Into the Mirror."

And I agree his role as YSS will be a big assest on his resume from now on. IYSS popularity in China, as reported by KBS, has made him a known celebrity there. The report said: "The popularity of actor Kim Myeong Min ... is rising as well, with many Chinese fans checking out Kim’s shooting schedule and posting inquiries about meeting the actor in person."

A few months back I also heard he was nominated for his role as YSS at one of the Emmy-like Korean award galas. He didn't win, as everyone predicted, but it's still an achievement to get nominated, and a way to have his name recognized.

Speaking of Mr. Kim, his film Sorum was liscensed and domestically released here in the USA about two weeks ago, so you all should be able to find it at your local video store! It's a dark, twisted film and Kim does a vicious job at his emotionally-detached character. (Not for the kids, though, and better for the ladies as an explicit sex scene gives you a nice view of his bare backside!)

Though I agree he's too mature for the usual romantic-comedy TV dramas, Kim definitely has the possibility to have an illustratious movie career ahead of him, to join the ranks of Jang Dong Gun or Choi Min Su! In my humble opinion anyway.

[Trespasser]

Well, according to Koreanwiz.org, he's only 32, almost 33.

That's considered an old age well past prime in Korean entertainment industry, you cannot land any leading role and have to contend with supporting roles.

I'll be rooting for him to get his pay raised

Of course his pay will rise as he will certainly go free agent after this series and net a couple commercials(This is where the actors really make most of their money), but he still won't make as much as younger and prettier actors currently dominating the leading roles.

TV drama market is primarily female driven, and the lead actors must cater to the taste of female audiences, which requires the lead actors to be young and pretty. YSS role was once in a life time opportunity for Mr. Kim, but he got it too late and he doesn't sport the looks to demand big salaries. Mr. Kim will never challenge the payscale of Yon Sama, Song Seung Hun, Kwon Sang Woo, Jang Dong Gun and so on.

[kinoeugene]

Guest said:

Trespasser said:

Haha. Ok, I am convinced. But tell me his name, Trespasser. I do not know this movie or this actor. ;D

His name is Choi Min Soo who is very famous actor in korea. Someone in this thread may remember the drama 'Moreshige' which was huge sensational 10 years ago.
The movie that this pic came from is 'ChungPungMyungWol - Clean Wind Bright Moon' filmed in 2003 and kinda historical fiction film about chosun's secret warriors.

[Guest]

Trespasser said:

Well, according to Koreanwiz.org, he's only 32, almost 33.

That's considered an old age well past prime in Korean entertainment industry, you cannot land any leading role and have to contend with supporting roles.

Wow. How depressing.

If this is true, then of the performers on IYSS, it would seem that only Jeon Ye-seo (Chung Hyang) is good-looking enough and young enough to have a chance to make it as a big-money star of romance dramas anytime soon.

[Guest]

Trespasser said:

I'll be rooting for him to get his pay raised

Of course his pay will rise as he will certainly go free agent after this series and net a couple commercials(This is where the actors really make most of their money), but he still won't make as much as younger and prettier actors currently dominating the leading roles.

TV drama market is primarily female driven, and the lead actors must cater to the taste of female audiences, which requires the lead actors to be young and pretty. YSS role was once in a life time opportunity for Mr. Kim, but he got it too late and he doesn't sport the looks to demand big salaries. Mr. Kim will never challenge the payscale of Yon Sama, Song Seung Hun, Kwon Sang Woo, Jang Dong Gun and so on.

Hmm, I see. I guess this makes sense. Well, thanks for this brief lesson on this aspect of the Asian TV market. ;D

[Guest]

kinoeugene said:

His name is Choi Min Soo who is very famous actor in korea. Someone in this thread may remember the drama 'Moreshige' which was huge sensational 10 years ago.
The movie that this pic came from is 'ChungPungMyungWol - Clean Wind Bright Moon' filmed in 2003 and kinda historical fiction film about chosun's secret warriors.

Thanks, kinoeugene, for answering me. ;D