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Post by JPh on Jul 3, 2005 9:33:17 GMT -5
As more people watch this drama, I think people will agree with me what a moronic idiot the Chosun King Sunjo was. Historically the Admiral not only had to fight the Japanese, he also had a handful with the King, his court, and jealous Won Kyun and his men. It's really difficult to fight in two battle fronts, one against the enemy,and the other against your own side who's only looking to bring you down. Look at the great battles and wars fought such heroes by Sir Franscis Drake who saved England. The Queen and the entire nation and their soldiers were behind their military leaders. Not so with Chosun's case. This is what makes Yi Soon Shin's accomplishments more remarkable. His battle field victories doesn't tell half the story because his biggest accomplishment was to do what was right instead of sucking up to a paranoic moronic king who had no ideal of running a military or a country for that matter.
Who was this King Sunjo? Was he possibly one of the worst Chosun kings in history? I'm not sure, but with one execption of King Sejong, most of the Chosun kings throughout history were dud heads who had absolutely 0% vision - proverbial frogs in the well. There were just too few visionaries in Chosun period Korea.
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Post by pakyownage4eva on Jul 3, 2005 9:43:45 GMT -5
Yeah, Sunjo sux!
He even wanted to leave his country.
Did he really recognize his faults and incompetence in history or are they just showing character changes in the drama?
Yet, the Korean people were very courageous in tremendous adversity...even when their King was running away to save his life, common civilians and even women fought to their deaths.
Also, my mom says that Kwang Hae (the Crown Prince) was a good King but he was ousted early..
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Post by donilpark on Jul 3, 2005 13:42:33 GMT -5
But then again, he was one of the most pitiable Kings in Chosun history.
He went through two huge wars against the Japanese and the Machus, and he lost to the latter, having to kneel before them.
He might have been a good ruler had it not been for those wars. Even if he was the best of the Kings, with such enormous wars (easily the two biggest wars in Chosun history) he couldn't possibly be a King with lots of achievement.
People are looking at Gwanghae with new perspective, but they shouldn't lose sight of others. Like Sunjo and Won Kyun. They must also have been trying to stop the war and everything. Just different ways, and their ways didn't work all that well. Can't blame for trying.
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Post by Choko on Jul 3, 2005 14:52:30 GMT -5
But then again, he was one of the most pitiable Kings in Chosun history. He went through two huge wars against the Japanese and the Machus, and he lost to the latter, having to kneel before them. donilpark, it was In-jo who knelt down before the Manchus. Prince Gwanghae was already ousted by In-jo's supporters at that time because they hated Gwanghae's foreign policy to negotiate with the Manchus. |
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Post by donilpark on Jul 3, 2005 15:41:14 GMT -5
Oh shoot. I don't know why I thought it was Sunjo. You're right. Dang.... it's such as shame...  |
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Post by passing by on Jul 3, 2005 16:46:12 GMT -5
According to the royal records, King Sunjo was a king with lots of promise in his younger days. However, as he grew older he became more political (where he tried to use the easterners against the westerners and vice versa to balance the power struggle among his cabinet members) and increasingly grew distrustful of his own son, Kwang-hae who he thought is always lurking to remove him from his kingship. This feeling of insecurity was not unwarranted since it had happened to his grand-uncle (Yeon-san-gun) and his uncle (In-Jong). The former was removed from the throne through a Joong-jong coup and the latter is thought to be poisoned by Myong-jong’s mother. Myong-jong ruled the country under the watchful eyes of his mother and his uncle (Yoon won-hyung). Oddly enough Injo (another ineffective king) poisons his own son Crown Prince So-hyun (sophisticated and cosmopolitan crown prince) because his crown prince was not hostile enough to the Manchus (the Ching). In fact, Chosun might have been more receptive to the western culture if Crown Prince So-hyun had ascended to the throne.
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Post by donilpark on Jul 3, 2005 17:17:34 GMT -5
But then Hyojong's hostility couldn't do much either since he died at young age and his ambition of conquering Qing went unfulfulled. (couldn't even start, in fact)
Some say he was poisoned too, but we would never know.
If they were really poisoned and it was known, then the morality of the ruling class would have been in serious jeopardy. So they made sure people never knew.
So we only speculate from the surrounding situations that those deaths may have been poisoning, not because there's any proof. Or is there?
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Post by JPh on Jul 3, 2005 17:45:18 GMT -5
I guess all the kings' jobs were to look out for their backs and to prop up and protect their social standings, rather than to really rule so that people can live with some form of dignity.
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Post by donilpark on Jul 3, 2005 18:31:51 GMT -5
You really dislike monarchism, don't you?
Well, I think, trying to keep your power in position was another job for the rulers.
Think about it, if old King is overthrown and new King ascends to throne and this happens everyday, then there can be no political stability. And then there's no one who can look out for the people.
Watching your back for treachery was a part of job a monarch had to do in order to tend to his/her people well.
I don't think many Kings were Kings because they liked it. They were born into it, and they had no other choice. Sometimes it may have been people around you who wanted you as the King and have powers themselves by sticking with you. Even if it was you yourself that wanted to be the King, I'm sure most (not all, of course) soon got tired of it.
If you ask me, I wouldn't become a King even for a day no matter how much power I can wield.
Living like a King is good, but doing a King's job is scary.
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Post by pakyownage4eva on Jul 5, 2005 9:43:51 GMT -5
ha. I have to say the King..
The Japanese couldn't touch admiral Yi Soon Shin but the admiral's own king tortured him and almost killed him for not obeying him on false intelligence that the Japanese were landing somewhere else.
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Post by Thedummie2 on Jul 11, 2005 14:55:49 GMT -5
Definitely the king. He's a stupid moron for doing what he does later on. Like pakyownage4eva said, the Japanese couldn't touch Yi Soon Shin, but his own king was jealous of his popularity among the common people, so he tortured him. Stupid bastard. Seriously, HOW STUPID was this king? |
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Post by ShawScope on Jul 12, 2005 2:39:12 GMT -5
I wished at the start of the invasion that Japanese would overrun the Court and kill off all those lazy beaurocrats and stupid King. Then Yi Soon Shin could've stepped into this void and assumed leadership of all Chosunese in their fight. Better slaughter these stupid fat cats who
left Chosun defenceless than innocent peasants.
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Post by florel on Jul 12, 2005 7:39:18 GMT -5
Who was this King Sunjo? Was he possibly one of the worst Chosun kings in history? I'm not sure, but with one exception of King Sejong, most of the Chosun kings throughout history were dud heads who had absolutely 0% vision - proverbial frogs in the well. There were just too few visionaries in Chosun period Korea. These are best & worst kings of Chosun I personally think. Best kings of Chosun1. Sejong (1418-1450) - finest reign of the Chosun kingdom 2. Jeongjo (1776-1800) - social and cultural renaissance of Chosun along with the reign of his grandfather Youngjo 3. Sungjong (1469-1494) - cultural height under the reign of the cultivated king 4. Youngjo (1724-1776) - social and cultural renaissance under his reign. but he killed his son (Crown Prince Sado, father of king Jeongjo). 5. Gwanghae (1608-1623) - diplomatic genius. but expelled from the throne by the Westerners' Coup after having killed his young half-brother and confined his stepmother in West Palace. Worst kings of Chosun1. Injo (1623-1649) - mounted on the throne by the Westerners' Coup. caused the Manchurian invasions (The Jungmyo and Byongja Wars). he is suspected of having killed his son, Crown Prince So-hyon. killed his daughter-in-law (wife of the Crown Prince). 2. Kojong (1863-1907) - absolutely incompetent while his father and wife were in political conflicts. also incompetent against Japanese and other foreigners' offensive acts. caused the fall of Chosun. 3. Sunjo (1567-1608) - incompetent against the Japanese invasions (The Imjin and Jungyoo Wars). persecutor of our lovely Admiral. 4. Yeonsan (1494-1506) - slaughterer of his officials and scholars. notorious for his debauchery life. expelled by a coup. 5. Soonjo (1800-1834) / Huhnjong (1827-1849) / Cheoljong (1849-1863) - never reigned. they were just crowned puppets. * The darkest period in Korean history was from the 19th to the mid 20th century (1800-1953). |
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Post by BungalowDweller on Jul 12, 2005 11:13:55 GMT -5
Thanks, Florel. Your replies have taught me so much! Bon voyage en vacances!
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Post by florel on Jul 13, 2005 8:07:19 GMT -5
Je vous en prie et merci, BD.
Un bon ete pour vous et pour tous !
Je vais partir ce weekend. Finalmente !! Viva!!!!
I'll do some upgrades of my chronicles before I'll be off.
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