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Post by seven stars on Aug 15, 2007 9:02:29 GMT -5
I was able to find english versions of the four Chinese classics at the bookstore on Wong Fu Jing street in Beijing. Each of them are packaged in four volume sets.
Even SGYY is difficult to find in an American bookstore these days.
It's a great bookstore by the way. You can find english books on the third floor.
They also have English translations of the Xi Ji by Sima Qian which is impossible to find stateside.
Exciting stuff! You've got to get geeked about that... more than a little bit.
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Post by seven stars on Aug 15, 2007 9:03:30 GMT -5
BTW I understand the cast has changed a bit for the upcoming "Battle of Red Cliff".
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Post by ginnycat5 on Aug 21, 2007 14:53:58 GMT -5
I was looking on Alibris site and there are 9 volumes!! Guess I could start with one. (But I thought it was about Korea-it's about China, so I'm not sure I want to take the plunge.)
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Post by seven stars on Aug 21, 2007 15:19:04 GMT -5
I was looking on Alibris site and there are 9 volumes!! Guess I could start with one. (But I thought it was about Korea-it's about China, so I'm not sure I want to take the plunge.) Hi Ginnycat, Yes it is a long read. If it means anything to you, I'm sure that numerous Koreans know this story by heart as well. I should think that it is the most well known epic in the entire far east. Could be wrong about that, but I can guarantee the reputation of SGYY (ROTK) in China and Japan with an educated guess that it's popularity stretches into Korea as well. You could probably find a Korean translation if you like. -7S
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Post by ginnycat5 on Aug 31, 2007 21:59:30 GMT -5
Thanks, 7S! I only read English and am very bad with names. Wonder if there's a library around here that has it, so I can take a peek at the first volume to see if it looks readable to me.
How was your trip to China? Did you go with a group? Very adventurous, to go so far!
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Post by seven stars on Sept 4, 2007 8:09:27 GMT -5
Hmm, I did find SGYY in a small New Jersey library once. My hunch is that it should be easy for you find in a larger city library.
My trip to China was wonderful Ginnycat. Thank you for asking!
It was my second time in Beijing and I cannot wait to return. My wife and traveled there with a small group of English teachers and will be visiting another university next year. There are many treasures in that country. The Great Wall is absolutely amazing to behold. However, I must point out the fact that the Chinese are the greatest treasure of the Middle Kingdom.
Thanks again Ginnycat.
Best always,
-7S
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Post by seven stars on Sept 5, 2007 15:02:16 GMT -5
Ginnycat,
I could always mail you my copy when I am done reading it if you like. I love to share.
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Post by maalii on Sept 8, 2007 0:04:39 GMT -5
The easiest way to purchase the Romance of the Three Kingdoms is probably through Amazon. There are the full priced versions and there are some less expensive versions of the same translations: for example the original Roberts translation was UC Press (?) but there is a low cost version (kind of low-quality paper, though) published by the Foreign Language Press out of Beijing that you can buy at Amazon for cheaper (have the FLP edition of the Roberts translation as well as the FLP edition of the Shapiro translation of Outlaws of the Marsh). The thing to watch out for is that there are two English translations: one by Roberts and one by Brewitt-Taylor and full and abridged versions exist for both. Make sure you get the full version, because the full beauty of RTK can only be appreciated in a full version where you get to see all the amazing inner detail. To give you idea of the richness of this novel, Chinese TV did a very good mega series of 84 episodes of RTK (very good but not as good as AOW) and although an accomplished work the megaseries was still RTK-Xtra-Lite, ie RTK highlights. In 84 good episodes they could only scratch the surface! There is little doubt this is one of the most influential novels in the history of humanity and it has certainly been an enormous influence on the literary and now the cinematic arts in Asia. In watching a drama such as Age of Warriors one could see many RTK-inspired plot twists, as well as characters. The same is true in Japanese dramas. It is indeed a very long read, but when you finish it you will realize how worth the effort it was. And it keeps getting better with every successive re-read because you can start to recognize more of the incredibly well-crafted inner detail.
Regarding the two translations. Most critics I am aware of say that the newer translation by Moss Roberts is the better of the two. It is certainly a bit smoother read, and it fills in a few gaps, and mends many of the hundreds of typos and small errors present in Brewitt-Taylor. However, I find that the Roberts version is emotionally a lot flatter than Brewitt-Taylor. Brewitt-Taylor is a much more dramatic read. Whether or not it is as true to the original as Roberts I don't know, given that I don't read Chinese (if I did I wouldn't bother with translations), but I think Brewitt-Taylor makes for better literature. Compare the epic poem that ends the novel in the two versions and you will know exactly what I mean. There is a majesty to Brewitt-Taylor that is lacking in Roberts. On the other hand Roberts has all these great notes on the development of the novel, historical notes all the way through, as well as maps of the major battles. Eventually, if you become a total RTK addict, you will have to get both. I am not totally sure how many times I have read RTK, but it is probably over a dozen times, of which three have been Roberts and the rest have been Brewitt-Taylor.
By the way, my second favorite novel is another Chinese classic, known as the Outlaws of the Marsh. It is on the same epic scale as RTK but it is a bit more like many western novels in structure, so it is easier to read. I've been trying to get my wife to read RTK (she still hasn't yet), so I got her to read Outlaws first as a "warm up". She thoroughly enjoyed Outlaws.
Enjoy RTK and let us know what you think.
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Post by seven stars on Sept 11, 2007 8:44:39 GMT -5
By the way, my second favorite novel is another Chinese classic, known as the Outlaws of the Marsh. It is on the same epic scale as RTK but it is a bit more like many western novels in structure, so it is easier to read. I've been trying to get my wife to read RTK (she still hasn't yet), so I got her to read Outlaws first as a "warm up". She thoroughly enjoyed Outlaws. Enjoy RTK and let us know what you think. Good to hear from you Maalii. I picked up outlaws at the Wong Fu Jing bookstore as well. How's your book coming along? -7S
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Post by maalii on Sept 14, 2007 22:52:43 GMT -5
7S,
It's good to check in once in awhile.
How do you like Outlaws? I very much enjoy it, but it is very different in structure than RTK.
My book has been slowly coming along. Since moving and becoming a full time academic, progress has been slower, given that I have virtually no time during the academic year. I realized this summer, though, that putting it completely on the shelf during the school year didn't work too well because I found this summer that it took me a month just to reacquaint myself with the story and characters. I am now up to Chapter 20. It is pretty complex, but I'm still doing this first pass as mainly stream-of-consciousness. The 3rd and 4th level inner detailing (RTK style) will be done in subsequent revisions. I have written large parts of what will be in the Chs. 50-80 range where the character from which my screen name is derived dominates the plot (think Kongming's strategy with Lu Bu's martial ability but with modern weaponry and technology and you kind of get the picture). The scene where he meets his demise has already been written and rewritten multiple times. I do have to send him off in style. I have now gone to writing things pretty much sequentially from the beginning, however.
Fresno doesn't have a network Korean (or Japanese or Chinese) channel. However, because Fresno doesn't have squat in terms of network channels, we're now on satellite and part of my hook up includes KBS. I haven't had time to watch much TV though now that we have two young kids. In point of fact I haven't even watched a complete sporting event (baseball, football, or even my favorite sport, hoops) on TV since I arrived in Fresno (not counting all the World Cup games I watched last year when away from home visiting my bro in Portugal). Consequently I still don't know whether the KBS I pick up via satellite has English subtitles or not. In terms of TV, I very much miss AOW. Owing to the unreliable local channel in the Bay Area and their irregular schedule, I caught only about a half of AOW. It is for me the standard by which all screen epics are measured. How I wish there were subtitled DVDs for the series out there. On the other hand, would I ever get time to watch them? The summer of '06 was spent sneaking in viewing of my RTK set after the kids fell asleep (perhaps that's why I didn't get much writing done that summer).
Cheers,
MM
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Post by seven stars on Sept 17, 2007 8:07:06 GMT -5
Wow it seems like you've been on the go Maalii.
Glad to hear that you have two young kids. Are you teaching in the Fresno area?
Regarding Outlaws (which is affectionately known unofficially in China as "the monkey king"), I have not yet gotten to reading it. I have long been an RTK enthusiast but this is actually the first copy that I myself have owned (M. Roberts by the way). For that reason I've devoted much of my free reading time to RTK. I recently pressed my way through the newly released Tolkien compilation "the children of hurin" as well. Other than that I'm slowly working my way through the bible and some larger biographical books (Che by John Lee Anderson, The Chinese by Jasper Becker and Son of the Rough South by Karl Fleming).
Maalii, I've got to tell you that Immortal Yi Soon Shin and now Dae Joyoung are every bit as good as, if not better than Age of Warriors in my opinion. If you have the opportunity to see either of them in the future I encourage you to take advantage of it.
I suppose most epic works begin with a core storyline around which the rest of the tale is formed. It sounds like this is true in the case of your work as Maalii.
Keep us posted. I am intrigued to hear more.
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Post by maalii on Sept 24, 2007 23:44:46 GMT -5
Are you teaching in the Fresno area? Regarding Outlaws (which is affectionately known unofficially in China as "the monkey king"), I have not yet gotten to reading it. I have long been an RTK enthusiast but this is actually the first copy that I myself have owned (M. Roberts by the way). For that reason I've devoted much of my free reading time to RTK. I recently pressed my way through the newly released Tolkien compilation "the children of hurin" as well. Other than that I'm slowly working my way through the bible and some larger biographical books (Che by John Lee Anderson, The Chinese by Jasper Becker and Son of the Rough South by Karl Fleming). Maalii, I've got to tell you that Immortal Yi Soon Shin and now Dae Joyoung are every bit as good as, if not better than Age of Warriors in my opinion. If you have the opportunity to see either of them in the future I encourage you to take advantage of it. I suppose most epic works begin with a core storyline around which the rest of the tale is formed. It sounds like this is true in the case of your work as Maalii. Keep us posted. I am intrigued to hear more. I am teaching at Fresno State (geology) now. Sounds like you've been reading a lot. I haven't had time to check to see if my KBC station (satellite) has subtitles and if it has Dae Joyoung. Sadly I wouldn't have time to watch it with the little ones to take care of. I was able to watch quite a bit of IYSS and while I thought it was very good, I didn't think it was quite up to AOW in terms of overall artistry. Returning to the two epics I'm writing, it is very difficult for me to keep the momentum going during the semester, given that I don't have very much time to write. Summer and winter break are my writing times. This school year I will try to get a bit done each week, otherwise it takes me forever to tie back into my storyline at the beginning of the break. Speaking of reading (excluding academic reading), in addition to the usual repeats of RTK and Outlaws, I went through the first two parts of Samsom's Japanese history trilogy again--I am paying special attention to the details from about 1050-1370; my second epic (a "prequel" of sorts) has it's inspiration in the period 1050-1189. I also reread a history book on the politics and art history of Hiraizumi whose story, along with the Gempei War forms the core of the inspiration for the second epic. I won't give away titles yet, but the abbreviations of the two epics are (minus "The"): BOD for the first one and SOJ (OOTFK) for the second one. The BOD is divided into three parts or "volumes" (EOTE, WATT, and WTWWO) the SOJ will probably be subdivided into three or four volumes itself. In a few years, perhaps.... In the meantime, enjoy RTK and (later) Outlaws. By the way, you'll enjoy Outlaws once you get through with your current RTK read. Outlaws is more single threaded (reads easier) and there is also a lot more martial arts in it. It also has a very cynical view of government and the lot of the commoner that is not unlike that we are familiar with in our Korean historical epics. Mixed in with this is a notable touch of humor--there are some utterly hilarious scenes in Outlaws. RTK is still the king for me, but there is a lot to like in Outlaws--cheers to Song Jiang, Li Kui, Sagacious Lu, and the rest of the unforgettable 108. And the ending of Outlaws is amazing and poignant. I had to write a "dream scene" of my own to close the SOJ (the only part of the SOJ I've actually written in anything other than outline form).
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Post by seven stars on Sept 28, 2007 8:50:34 GMT -5
I'm with you until the Japanese literature Maalii. I am "illiterate" in that arena. But you make me want to put SGYY on hold and get right to Outlaws. Of course I cannot do that, but am looking forward to it all the more based upon your remarks.
It's exciting to know that someone of your interests is investing in the young people of Fresno, CA.
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Post by seven stars on Sept 28, 2007 8:57:29 GMT -5
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Post by geesehoward4ever on Oct 25, 2007 23:45:33 GMT -5
Battle of Red Cliffs should be interesting. I recently got the Chinese TV version of Romance of the Three Kingdoms, on DVD! Some DvD players won't play it, even though it is coded region one, so!?!? I decided to think American and go for the lowest quality DvD player and VIOLA! Plays like nobodies business! LOL! It's horrible to have to think like that, but that's the way too many things are right now.
I look forward to Red Cliffs, but I have no clue if it will be shown over here in the States or what, any clue Seven Stars?
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