|
Post by ID on Feb 10, 2005 19:52:09 GMT -5
I love anything with Bronson. He was so cruel. In Death Wish 3, some muggers messed with him, so, he heads out during dinner, finds them, and rather than talk it out, he puts huge bullet holes in each of them! Then he goes back home, probably enjoying his meal even more! Now that's what I call badass!
|
|
|
Post by seven stars on Feb 11, 2005 9:28:53 GMT -5
Yeah, and before he left the house for his adventures that evening, he told his family that he was "going out for some ice cream". He actually did get a cone before he ran into those thugs.
|
|
|
Post by Maalii on Mar 2, 2005 1:14:23 GMT -5
SF just saw EP3 (actually 4th, but the "1st" had a "pt 1" and "pt 2") of Yosh_tsune this past weekend. It's shaping up well. It looks like they got through the childhood part by the end of Ep3 and it looks like it will add some drama to later developments. I like the way they've drawn Taira Kiyomori up to this point--showing his more human and cultured side in contrast to his notorious tyrant personality. It makes sense in a way, because it would otherwise be hard to explain how he let Yoritomo, Noriyori, and Yosh_tsune live after putting down the attempted power grab led by their father Minamoto Yosh_tomo (and executing him afterwards). I hope they will evolve that character well, given that in history he was supposed to become more irrational and tyrannical with time (like many military leaders). In any case, it looks like we'll have more shades of gray in this one (like AOW and unlike YSS which is more like Lord of the Rings with the Japanese and nomads as Orcs). One thing that's really cool about this series is that some of the first episodes were followed by a short bit showing the modern day locations of where some of these events unfolded. The Japanese dramas have been doing this for awhile, but this is the first series I've seen where this "postscript" is subtitled as the main drama is.
|
|
|
Post by skinz unlogged on Mar 22, 2005 9:37:39 GMT -5
Old-topic but just wanted to know how the drama was doing. Any action yet or is it just all politics? How's Kiyomori Taira and Yoritomo Minamoto?
|
|
|
Post by Maalii on Mar 22, 2005 14:44:30 GMT -5
Old-topic but just wanted to know how the drama was doing. Any action yet or is it just all politics? How's Kiyomori Taira and Yoritomo Minamoto? The show looks pretty good so far, although compared to Korean dramas, the slow pace takes a bit getting used to. You get about as much happening in two or three hour-long (actually, counting the ads, you're looking at 45 min or so, I'd guess) as in one episode of AOW or YSS. Nonetheless the first few episodes have had some surprises. First Taira Kiyomori is depicted as being much softer at heart than one would expect from historical descriptions of him and his depiction in the Heike Monogatari. In fact, his oldest son (who eventually dies before Kiyomori does), Shigemori is depicted as being somewhat more hawkish than Kiyomori, which is the opposite of what one generally hears. Now Kiyomori is supposed to get progressively more irrational and tyrannical with time, so perhaps they'll show that. I guess one thing the gentler depiction of Kiyomori explains is why he didnt' execute all of Minamoto Yosh_tomo's male children after he defeated Yosh_tomo's coup attempt. These children, included Yosh_tsune (then an infant), Noriyori, and, of course, Yoritomo. One thing that I was not aware of was that Kiyomori essentially took in Yosh_tsune's mother and had a child by her and that Yosh_tsune grew up in the Taira household (a veritable sibling of his later military opponents such as Shigehira and Tomomori) until being sent to a monastery in his pre-teen years. That early history adds an interesting twist to the plot. As of this past episode we got to see Hojo Tokimasa and his formidable daughter, Masako, for the first time (as well as Masako's first meeting with Yoritomo). Tokimasa was assigned by the Taira to keep watch on the exiled Yoritomo who by this time was in his early 20's. Masako later becomes Yoritomo's wife, and on Yoritomo's death Masako and her father establish the Hojo regency that essentially rules Japan for over 150 years, supplanting Yoritomo's own descendants (although following the general layout of government that Yoritomo and others constructed). From the look of this episode it looks like they will do justice to the character of the great Masako who was arguably the last female leader of medieval Japan. I recall the story goes that the Masako-Yoritomo marriage was actually a genuine romance (in contrast to the usual arranged political marriage) in that Masako is said to have essentially eloped with Yoritomo--one can bet they'll show that. I am still disappointed with the physical appearance of the actor they chose to play Yoritomo--he doesn't come close to the ruthless presence depicted in his most famous portrait. For that matter Kiyomori looks wrong with his funny little mustache (not quite as bad as Victor Conte of BALCO fame, but getting there) instead of the goatee I've seen in paintings of him. Getting back to other aspects of the plot threads we have also already seen the appearance of Shizuka, the singing girl who is Yosh_tsune's longtime lover, as well as the famed "Benkei on the Bridge" scene where the young Yosh_tsune beats the powerful monk Benkei in a duel--Benkei later becomes Yosh_sune's right hand man.
|
|
|
Post by skinz on Mar 22, 2005 16:24:03 GMT -5
As of this past episode we got to see Hojo Tokimasa and his formidable daughter, Masako, for the first time (as well as Masako's first meeting with Yoritomo). Ah! Masako. Damn, I wish I could see this drama. Do you know how long the series is? I might just have to start saving if it comes out on DVD or something.
|
|
|
Post by Maalii on Mar 22, 2005 19:22:18 GMT -5
Ah! Masako. d**n, I wish I could see this drama. Do you know how long the series is? I might just have to start saving if it comes out on DVD or something. I don't know how many episodes are planned. The Japanese drama series tend to last a bit over a year, so at one episode per week, we're probably looking at 60-80 episodes or so. Given that the Gempei War, Yosh_tsune v Yoritomo, Yoritomo v Hiraizumi etc. has so many different elements to it, I would hope that this series is an extended one, although I myself will have to have somebody in the SF area record this for me soon as I will be leaving the area and moving somewhere (CA Central Valley) where we don't get either Japanese or Korean TV. Speaking of Hiraizumi the last episode mentioned that place for the first time, for Yosh_tsune now a teenager/young man is forced to flee from the monastery he's been staying at just outside Kyoto as the Taira are now getting a bit more concerned about the Minamoto offspring. Yosh_tsune takes shelter in Hiraizumi under the protection of the powerful Hiraizumi lord, Fujiwara Hidehira. He emerges from there later to fight and play the decisive role in the Gempei war, but eventually flees there years later when Yoritomo decides to do away with him. It is at Hiraizumi that he is betrayed by Hidehira's grandson, Yasuhira, who fears Yoritomo's wrath if he doesn't give Yosh_tsune up--Yosh_tsune kills his family and commits suicide when besieged. Of course this doesn't stop Yoritomo from invading Hiraizumi anyway (it's the last part of Japan he doesn't control) and Yasuhira is soon himself betrayed by a vassal who delivers his head to Yoritomo. Anyhow the first mention of Hiraizumi in this show is that of this essentially independent northern state that is said to be a paradise free of war and rivalling or surpassing Kyoto in art and culture. Yes the Hiraizumi story alone is a compelling one (they did a drama series on it about 12 years ago).
|
|
|
Post by Jangune on May 7, 2005 17:26:37 GMT -5
I've been watching this drama, and I'm curious to see how things play out. I know that Yoritomo became fearful of Yosh.tsune's brilliance in the end, but I can't imagine that long-nosed man acting like that as of yet. Neither can I imagine Yosh.tsune's "arrogance."
The last Japanese drama was Shinsengumi, and that was 100+ episodes, I believe. Be prepared for longevity.
|
|
|
Post by Maalii on May 7, 2005 23:31:01 GMT -5
I've been watching this drama, and I'm curious to see how things play out. I know that Yoritomo became fearful of Yosh.tsune's brilliance in the end, but I can't imagine that long-nosed man acting like that as of yet. Neither can I imagine Yosh.tsune's "arrogance." The last Japanese drama was Shinsengumi, and that was 100+ episodes, I believe. Be prepared for longevity. I think about 100 episodes would be about right, although the Japanese dramas (such as Shinsegumi, etc) tend to last longer chronologically than AOW because the Japanese shows only do one episode a week instead of two. I liked Shinsengumi because it was edgier than the average Japanese historical drama, although I still think it was a far cry from the level of AOW. I have found the opening episodes of Yosh_sune fascinating in that the depiction of Kiyomori departs significantly from the "traditional" (ie Heike Monogatari) depiction of him. In this version he is viewed as being quite compassionate and his eldest son Shigemori, traditionally portrayed as being more moderate, is portrayed in the show as more hot headed. I'm a bit put off by the fact that they didn't choose actors that appeared more like the paintings of Kiyomori and, especially Yoritomo--the latter's most famous portrait really shows a cold blooded ruthless side. I think the appearance of Yosh_tsune is what pretty much how most viewers (including me) would have visualized him. I liked the first appearance of Kiso no Yoshinaka, too--yeah that's the way I wanted to see him cast. I think the depiction of Hiraizumi and Fujiwara Hidehira is a bit too idealized, but, then again, I have, as many have, always sort of liked the Hiraizumi legend, so it's OK with me. Still, I can only imagine how much greater this drama would be if it had the genius of writing, directing, and acting displayed on AOW. As far as Yoritomo goes, it will be very interesting to see how they evolve his character. I wonder, for instance, if they will end up blaming much of his more ruthless behavior (such as killing of Yosh_sune, Noriyori, etc) on Kajiwara Kagetoki's incessant slander--I hope not, because I think that would be the cheap way out.
|
|
|
Post by Jangune on May 8, 2005 21:34:00 GMT -5
This period of time fascinates me, the Taira-Minamoto (aka Heike-Genji, Gempei Wars) era.
Taira Kiyomori has indeed been blessed with a compassionate portrayal. In most pro-Genji shows, it's usually "evil Kiyomori! The devil man! Evil evil evil!" In "Yosh.tsune", he is portrayed as a fatherly figure that Kuro does not wish to betray. Yosh.tsune's casting was very ... eye-candied. My sister initially only watched it because she saw the trailer and fell in love with his face. The show got her hooked, though.
However, I did find that the acting in AoW was far more realistic. I mean, despite the fact that 75% of the time, KDS had the same glaring expression (although he was looking in different directions), I'd have to say that Yosh.tsune has the same crinkly-nosed, wistful expression about 90% of the time.
Again, though, I am interested to see character development turns out.
|
|
|
Post by Maalii on May 11, 2005 22:01:53 GMT -5
However, I did find that the acting in AoW was far more realistic. I mean, despite the fact that 75% of the time, KDS had the same glaring expression (although he was looking in different directions), I'd have to say that Yosh.tsune has the same crinkly-nosed, wistful expression about 90% of the time. AOW has set a very high standard. I had been watching Japanese historical dramas for 20+ years and I don't think any I saw came close to AOW in quality. Speaking of the historical period of the Gempei war and Yosh.tsune, there are some interesting AOW parallels. First, there is a big overlap in time. AOW runs 1170 to ~1200, whereas Yosh.tsune runs from 1160 Yosh.tomo (father of Yoritomo and Yosh.tsune) is killed to I'd presume 1189 when Yosh.tsune is killed. Second, Choi Choonghon takes power he establishes a heriditary miltary dicatorship without outright claiming the throne. In a like manner, so does Minamoto Yoritomo. Third, Choonghon's younger brother plays a key role in his takeover and is later killed by Choonghon, and Yoritomo's younger brother (Yosh.tsune) plays a key role in his rise to power as the architect of the major victories in the later part of the Gempei War (Kiso Yoshinaka was the biggest player in the early part of the war) and is killed by Yoritomo.
|
|
|
Post by Jangune on May 12, 2005 0:51:43 GMT -5
Really? I found that AoW was extremely absorbing; however, when it came to having a deep and heartfelt storyline, I'd have to say that "Ho Joon" far surpassed AoW standards (not a war drama; it's a historical drama about the life of a famous Korean doctor in the ancient times). I also enjoyed "Wang Geon" (though it did get tedious after so many episodes). I'd have to notice that these periods do seem to share similarities, and that this drama does have a lot of promise. However, I'd like to see more character development. Remembering what I said earlier, I'm still quite a bit disappointed that "Yosh.tsune" actually needs a narrator to explain itself and the actors seem to be made of either wood, stone, or both. I'd like to see it warm up as it moves along
|
|
|
Post by skinz on Aug 24, 2005 9:59:37 GMT -5
Does anyone know if this series is done? If so, can anyone tell me how the sea battle was represented.
|
|
|
Post by donilpark on Aug 29, 2005 17:49:52 GMT -5
I think it's still going on. I think they aired up to episode 33. I watched this until episode 20, but I felt it was dragging too much and got boring even though they were only 40 minute long episodes each. So I stopped watching.
|
|