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Post by MTR on May 8, 2013 23:53:07 GMT -5
51 episodes are subtitled on Dramacrazy ,what is a good episode to start watching this avoiding all the silly stuff ?
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Post by truth on May 9, 2013 21:41:57 GMT -5
51 episodes are subtitled on Dramacrazy ,what is a good episode to start watching this avoiding all the silly stuff ? I'm not sure which episode it was, but try starting with Bidam's rebellion.
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HungV
Senior Addict
Posts: 258
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Post by HungV on May 10, 2013 2:09:30 GMT -5
51 episodes are subtitled on Dramacrazy ,what is a good episode to start watching this avoiding all the silly stuff ? I'm not sure which episode it was, but try starting with Bidam's rebellion. It's 45 or 46.
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Post by MTR on May 11, 2013 5:02:51 GMT -5
Great many thanks guys .
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Post by truth on May 11, 2013 18:22:24 GMT -5
Episode 61
This episode followed history for the most part except when King Muyeol goes to save Tang soldiers from the Baekje Revival Movement. Muyeol was not a warrior, so he never went to any war in history. In history, Muyeol sent his son Beopmin(King Moonmu) to save the Chinese.
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Post by truth on May 18, 2013 9:02:55 GMT -5
Episode 63
The Errors
Kim Choon Chu continues to employ sophistry by saying he wants unity and peace of the three kingdoms, but trying his best to wipe out the Baekje Revival Movement lol.
Kim Yushin is allying with YGSM to rise against Kim Choon Chu who he thinks had become a dog of the Chinese. Beopmin(King Moonmu) also hates his father for being pro-Chinese, so he will most likely be joining Yushin's rebel army. WTF? What the heck is the wrong with the writer? Kim Yushin and Beopmin supported KCC all the way in history. One more thing, why did Yushin get rid of Alcheon who was allying with YGSM during Jindeok's reign if he himself was going to ally with YGSM anyway?
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Post by truth on Jun 3, 2013 3:29:16 GMT -5
Episode 67
Kim Choon Chu is finally dead. Bokshin is dead as well.
Here's the final batch of translations
King Bojang had four sons.
Go Boknam - Boknam was the first son of Bojang and the last Crown Prince of Gogureo. On 666, he was sent to China by Bojang to attend Emperor Taizong of Tang's traditional ritual. On 686, Tang tried to make Boknam's son Bowon as the new King of Joseon, but Bowon refused to do so.
Go Immu- Immu was the second son of Bojang. On December of 647, he was sent to China by Bojang to sign a peace treaty with Emperor Taizong. However, Taizong broke the treaty on April of 648 by invading Goguryeo.
Go Deokmu - Deokmu was the third son of Bojang. On 699, he was appointed by Tang as the Governor of Andong Protectorate.
Go Anseung - On February of 669, Anseung the King of Goguryeo Revival Movement surrendered to Shilla. Shilla appointed Anseung as the King of Bodeok. On 680, Anseung married King Moonmu's daughter. On 683, Anseung moved to Kyungju, received the last name Kim, and became a Shilla noble.
Life of Yeon Gaesomoon
Goguryeo was divided into two sides during the rule of King Young Ryu. One side were the Pacifists, led by King Young Ryu, who wanted to secure stability by paying tributes to Tang and the other side were the Hardliners, led by Yeon Gaesomoon, who wanted Goguryeo to remain a sovereign nation by fighting against Tang. Pacifists had the bigger power since King Young Ryu himself was a Pacifist and King Young Ryu ordered the Hardliners to build walls in order to get rid of them from the royal court.
Yeon Gaesomoon pretended to have a parade to celebrate the departure of Hardliners to the wall construction. When the Pacifist court members arrived at the parade, YGSM's army killed all of them. Afterwards, YGSM went straight to the palace and killed King Young Ryu. YGSM enthroned Young Ryu's nephew Bojang as the new king and assigned himself to a new post called Makriji(Dictator).
No one dared to challenge YGSM except for one man, the Lord of Anshi, Yang Manchun. Yang Manchun considered YGSM's coup as disloyalty and criticized his actions. YGSM sent army to Anshi multiple times because of this, but all his attempts ended up in failure. He had no choice but to allow Yang Manchun to continue his post as the Lord of Anshi.
YGSM replaced every other lords of the Tang-Goguryeo border areas and court members with people who are favorable to him. He also constructed new walls and increased the number of soldiers in his army.
Goguryeo succeeded in defeating every Tang invasions due to YGSM's efforts. Unfortunately, Goguryeo started going downhill after YGSM's death on 666. YGSM's first son Yeon Namseng took over the Great Prime Minister role when YGSM passed away. While Yeon Namseng was patrolling the northern borders, Namgun and Namsan heard that Namseng was plotting to kill them. Namgun and Namsan didn't believe the rumor. Namseng, on the other hand, heard the rumor about his younger brothers plotting to kill him. Namseng sent a spy to Pyongyang to find out whether the rumor is true. Namgun and Namsan arrested the spy and decided that the rumor was true. They then killed all of Namseng's close friends and took over the authority role. Yeon Namseng, who was at Guknae Fortress at the time, asked Tang for help. Emperor Gaozong sent Xui Biheli to rescue Yeon Namseng. Namseng then surrendered to Tang.
Yeon Namseng, who was very familiar with the geography of Goguryeo, became the guide for Tang army ever since his surrender which enabled Tang to conquer Goguryeo.
Taizong's invasion of Goguryeo
On March of 645, Li Shimin invaded Goguryeo with 100,000 Chinese soldiers. 40,000 crossed the sea with 500 ships. Li Shimin himself led 60,000 through land. 50,000 Gokturks and Khitans came to Tang's aid, so Tang had total of 150,000 soldiers. On April, Li Shiji attacked Goguryeo's Shin Fortress. Zhang Jian led the Gokturks and Khitans to attack Guhn Ahn Fortress. However, they failed to conquer these fortresses and conquered Gaemo Fortress instead. 10,000 Goguryean soldieres were captured and 100,000 sacks of grains were taken from Gaemo.
Zhang Liang's 43,000 navy that crossed the sea surrounded Bisa Fortress on April. Goguryeans eventually ran out of food and Bisa was conquered on May. Li Shiji, Li Shimin, Gokturks, and Khitans then conquered Yodong(Liadong) Fortress in just 12 days. Baek Ahm Fortress surrendered few days after. Li Shimin then went on to Anshi Fortress with his 50,000, Li Shiji's 10,000 and 100,000 Gokturks and Khitans.
YGSM gave 150,000 troops to Go Yeonsu and Go Hyejin to prevent Tang from attacking Anshi. When Li Shimin heard that Go Yeonsu was not a good military officer, Li Shimin was sure of his victory. He expected Go Yeonsu to trust the number of Goguryeo soldiers and attack without thinking a lot.
Just as Li Shimin had expected, Go Yeonsu was planning to directly attack Tang's frontline without any special tactics. A skilled general named Go Jeong Ui thought they should form a defensive line and engage in attrition warfare. Go Jeong Ui thought they should wait until Tang army gets worn out and cut off the Chinese supply lines. However, Go Yeonsu didn't listen to GJU. He thought it was important to suppress the enemy morale by showing the might of his army. Li Shimin sent 1,000 Gokturks to lure Goguryean army. Go Yeonsu easily defeated them, became very confident, and decided to engage in wide-open warfare.
This was a very dangerous thought. Goguryeo was used to fighting on mountains and defending from fortress, so they had more chance to lose in a wide-open warfare. The Tang Chinese, on the other hand, had all the equipment required for a wide-open warfare. In addition, every Chinese soldiers were fully trained while most of Goguryeo soldiers weren't except for Go Yeonsu's personal army. Li Shimin knew all about this and engaged in a psychological warfare.
Li Shimin sent a messenger to Go Yeonsu saying that he did not come to Goguryeo to conquer Goguryeo and that he just wanted to teach the manners of a vassal state. If Goguryeo shows the manner of a vassal state to him, his army would immediately return to China after giving back all the territories he took over so far in this war. Go Yeonsu assumed that Li Shimin had no intention to fight after hearing the message and let his guard down. Li Shimin used the opportunity to ambush Go Yeonsu with his 26,000 troops led by Xui Rengui.
Goguryeo suffered a huge loss as a result of the ambush. 30,000 soldiers died, Go Yeonsu and Go Hyejin surrendered to Li Shimin along with their 36,000 soldiers, and the rest of Goguryean troops retreated to Shin Fortress and Guhn Ahn Fotress.
Anshi Fotress was completely isolated after this loss and Li Shimin used his entire army to attack Anshi from this point on. Anshi had 30,000 soldiers and 70,000 civilians at the time. Yang Manchun was determined to use even the 70,000 civilians to fight the Tang army.
On the first day of attack, Li Shiji retreated after endless arrows flying from Anshi. On the next day, Li Shiji yelled at Anshi : "I will bury every men in Anshi on the day I conquer Anshi!"
Go Yeonsu suggested attacking Ogol Fortress by saying that the governor of Ogol was old and stupid. Yeonsu knew this would lessen Tang's attack on Anshi and open Tang's back to the 100,000 Goguryeo troops from Shin and Guhn Ahn Fortress. Li Shimin and Li Shiji almost accepted Yeonsu's suggestion, but declined after Zhangsun Wuji insisted that attacking Ogol would open Tang's back to other Goguryean troops.
Li Shimin attacked Anshi countless times afterwards, which all ended up in failure. Soldiers were quickly killed on the moment they climbed up the wall with ropes and ladders. When stones destroyed parts of the walls, the Goguryeans quickly built a wooden wall in place.
Li Shimin even built a mud castle that was higher than Anshi Fortress in order to get in the fortress, but this also ended up in failure. When an avalanche occurred, parts of Anshi Fortress were destroyed. Yang Manchun turned this emergency as an opportunity and sent his troops to conquer Tang's Mud Castle. Tang used 500,000 men to build the mud castle in just 60 days only to give it away to Goguryeo as its new defensive line.
Tang lost a lot of its supplies and armies during its attempts to conquer Anshi and many of the troops also froze and starved to death when the winter came in October. Tang had no choice but to retreat. When Li Shimin began retreating, Yang Manchun stood on the top of Anshi Fortress alone and waved his hand at Li Shimin. Li Shimin, amazed by Yang's intelligence and bravery, sent Yang 100 pieces of silk as gift before retreating.
The name of Anshi's Lord/Governor actually is actually unknown, however, Song Joon Gil and Park Jiwon of Joseon dynasty claim that the name of this brave man was Yang Manchun. Goryeo/Koryo dynasty's Yi Sek and Yi Gok claim that Li Shimin got shot in his eye during this battle.
Anshi Fortress was finally conquered by Tang on July of 671. It is unknown whether Yang Manchun died during this time or before.
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Post by ajk on Jun 3, 2013 12:12:50 GMT -5
Thanks for the translations, truth, as always--really appreciate your generosity in sharing these (not to mention your skill in preparing them).\
A lot here that I remember learning from DJY. That series sure did go off in silly directions history-wise, but especially in the first 50 episodes there was a lot of interesting historical material.
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Post by MTR on Jun 3, 2013 13:05:24 GMT -5
The silly directions prevented DJY from joining the ranks of the greats ,it is funny to look back at DJY because some blocks of episodes like from the first ep to the fall of Goguryeo in eps 38/39 and some of the later episodes like Tang /Khitan war and the last 20 leading to the foundation of Balhae rank alongside the best ,on the flip side the sillyness was a forerunner of the new direction Historical Dramas would take like Iron Empress and Gwanggaeto . Still in light of recent offerings save God Of War we would not mind another DJY at this point .
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Post by truth on Jun 3, 2013 16:08:29 GMT -5
Episode 68 marked the end of Baekje Revival Movement
With 2 more episodes to go, I'm guessing Episode 69 will cover the war with Goguryeo and episode 70 will cover the war between Tang and Shilla.
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Post by truth on Jun 8, 2013 10:55:01 GMT -5
Episode 69 marked the end of Goguryeo dynasty.
This episode made me think back to the end of Goguryeo in KBS Dae Jo Young.
Comparison between two dramas (HA=historically accurate)
Shilla is the main force (GKD) vs Tang is the main force (DJY) HA
Yeon Namseng is a loser in both dramas
Emperor Gaozong is a powerful leader (GKD) vs Gaozong is a puppet of his wife(DJY) HA
Li Shiji is the Commander of Tang-Shilla (GKD) HA vs Xui Rengui is the Commander of Tang-Shilla (DJY)
Shin Sung is a patriot who saves the Goguryean people by opening the gate of Pyongyang (GKD) vs Shin Sung is an evil traitor (DJY)
King Bojang orders Shin Sung to open the gates(GKD) vs Shin Sung never talks to Bojang about his plan (DJY) HA
Yeon Namsan surrenders during the war (GKD) HA vs Yeon Namsan doesn't make appearance in the drama (DJY)
Yeon Namgun only cares about his dictator position (GKD) vs Yeon Namgun is a patriot willing to sacrifice for his country (DJY)
Dae Jo Young doesn't make appeareance in the drama (GKD)HA vs Dae Jo Young fights against Tang-Shilla forces (DJY)
End of Goguryeo is a glorious victory for Tang-Shilla (GKD) vs End of Goguryeo is a sad tragedy for DJY (DJY)
I wonder if this drama would cover the Goguryeo Revival Movement by Go Anseung and Geom Mojam or the one by King Bojang.
Here are some actors who made appearance in both GKD and DJY (not all, but some)
Kim Choon Chu (GKD, Shillan) = Dae Jo Young (DJY, Goguryean)
King Jinpyung (GKD, Shillan) = Bu Kiwon (DJY, Goguryean)
Bidam (GKD, Shillan) = Gulsabiwu (DJY, Malgal)
Bokshin (GKD, Baekjenese) = Shin Sung (DJY, Goguryean)
Kim Pumil (GKD, Shillan) = On Samun (DJY, Goguyrean)
Liu Ren Yuan (GKD, Chinese) = Li Shiji (DJY, Chinese)
Emperor Tenji (GKD, Japanese) = Yeon Namgun (DJY, Goguryean)
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Post by MTR on Jun 9, 2013 4:32:57 GMT -5
What is your overall opinion of this Truth ?.
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Post by truth on Jun 9, 2013 13:04:58 GMT -5
Just finished watching the last episode (Episode 70). They didn't cover Goguryeo Revival Movement. The war between Tang and Shilla lasted 1 minute lol. Kim Yushin and King Moonmu died in this episode.
My overall opinion is that it was Choi Soo Jong's worst historical ever lol.
MTR, I don't know if you're still watching, but I suggest you stop watching when Bidam's rebellion is over. Bidam's rebellion is the most interesting part of the drama and the drama starts going downhill afterwards.
Best GKD actor award goes to Choi Cheol Ho(Bidam). I hope he comes out in the next year's Jeong Dojeon as well.
Well, this is the end of KBS's 3 year Three Kingdom trilogies (Geunchogo, Gwanggaeto, GKD).
I can't believe I'm saying this, but King Geunchogo was the best one out of the three trilogies. Geunchogo was actually really good except the stupid love story with Buyeo Hwa and the Sekobi slave storyline.
Ratings : Gwanggaeto >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Geunchogo, GKD Story/Acting: Geunchogo>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>GKD>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Gwanggaeto Historical Accuracy(Armor/Clothes): Geunchogo>>>>GKD>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Gwanggaeto Historical Accuracy(Historical accounts): GKD>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Gwanggeto, Geunchogo
The best traditional weekend historical in my opinion after DJY ended in 2007 have to be God of War, followed up by Geunchogo.
Hopefully, next year's Jeong Dojeon would revive the fame of KBS weekend historicals that began with Tears of Dragon and ended with Dae Jo Young. I'm also wondering which one would get better ratings, KBS Jeong Dojeon or MBC Heaven Breaking Emperor? Both are about foundation of Joseon dynasty but Yi Sunggye is the main character for MBC while Jeong Dojeon is obviously the main character for KBS.
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Post by MTR on Jun 9, 2013 13:25:24 GMT -5
I could not even watch Gwanggaeto and yes im just going to watch the Bidam Rebellion in GKD .
I liked Geunchogo ,despite the historical tinkering it was not silly ,notice how when the main characters die in these dramas they get carried to a hill with their fave scenic view ,its a new thing i think Sejong was the first to get the ball rolling on this .
I have a feeling Jeong Dojeon is going to be a lot more serious than KBS recent offerings ,i really expect we shall see something along the lines of Sejong .
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Post by mugwump on Jun 10, 2013 17:43:43 GMT -5
I think King Geunchogo was the last intelligent historical KBS has done. Too bad GKD followed in the footsteps of Iron Empress and Gwanggaeto.
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