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Post by sageuk on May 28, 2010 21:51:13 GMT -5
We like Immortal Yi Soon-shin. But whether we are a fan of it or not, there are particular things that we'd like to take control of.
If it were me, I would improve the background storyline. I wouldn't say I hate it, but that part just wasn't as engaging.
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Post by mikey on May 29, 2010 20:04:11 GMT -5
I loved IYSS . . . but I thought that the Japanese characters were handled rather poorly. They were just a little too cartoonish for my taste sometimes.
Still, it was a great drama show, for sure.
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Post by sageuk on May 29, 2010 23:00:29 GMT -5
I told my dad about members here criticizing the portrayal of the Japanese as being cartoonish. He replied "Japanese people were cartoonish to begin with". We're Koreans, so he's a little biased. I'm not anti-Japanese though.
While I found the Japanese over the top at times, I found it easier to take them seriously as a threat than the Khitans in Iron Empress
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Post by mikey on May 30, 2010 17:32:44 GMT -5
While I found the Japanese over the top at times, I found it easier to take them seriously as a threat than the Khitans in Iron Empress Well, no argument there! ;D I'm Caucasian/American, so I don't have a dog in this fight (so to say) and I must admit that I did enjoy Japanese "Taiga Dramas," back when I was able to watch them in California. Still, there's little argument that the Japanese were the Bad Guys in this conflict. It's just that they sometimes came off looking a little like the Nazis in "Hogan's Heroes" (I've always been a little turned-off by drama shows that make ruthless conquerors look silly). BTW, I think that's why Yi Soon-shin was so admired and respected. He didn't fight for foreign conquest, he fought only to defend his homeland from the invaders. Admiral Yi was a hero in the purest sense. Who couldn't admire such a man?
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Post by TheBo on Jun 1, 2010 12:49:15 GMT -5
I, too, thought the Japanese characters were the weakest, flattest parties in the drama. The reason I object to this is not because I thought they were somehow "not" the bad guys in this situation, but because when you see such ridiculously shallow portrayals, they seem LESS evil, not as they really were. If something is cartoonish, it is not believable. This is a disservice to the Koreans in the eyes of non-Koreans, too. After all, one could think, if the Japanese were so stupid and blind, how come the Koreans didn't just outsmart them?
I have some friends who are watching the "shortened" version of the drama, and they hate it. It was long, but all that background brought humanity to the main character(s) and made you understand why YSS's men followed him.
Bo
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Post by sageuk on Jun 1, 2010 15:12:46 GMT -5
Yeah, I know very well that the background was necessary in order to make Yi Soon Shin human, not a hero sent by heaven. Just thought a few tweaks could have been done. Like I said, I don't hate the background.
Oh, I forgot to mention that we could have done without the Chunsu storyline. I found that to be a distraction.
How would you humanize the Japanese more?
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Post by TheBo on Jun 1, 2010 15:14:49 GMT -5
HAH! I forgot about Chunsu. Everyone hated that--after the fact, that is. Because they dropped it. I think it was due to the guy getting injured or something equally unfortunate. I was only saying that I thought the background was necessary, not that everyone thinks so. Bo
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Post by mikey on Jun 4, 2010 22:00:12 GMT -5
How would you humanize the Japanese more? I had to chew on this one for a while, since the answer isn't as obvious as I'd like it to be. Consider, for example, the WWII movie "Tora! Tora! Tora!" and its portrayal of the Japanese sailors. I haven't seen it in years, but as I recall it gave a fair shake to both sides (especially Admiral Yamamoto, who seemed genuinely worried that the attack on Pearl Harbor might ultimately bring grief upon Japan). And I recall how the Japanese naval dive-bombers seemed to take particular glee in torpedoing American warships - and that it wasn't quite as much fun for them when the tables began to turn at Midway. I thought that "Tora! Tora! Tora!" illustrated the Japanese mentality much more realistically than did IYSS, and that the Japanese, though appearing pretty ruthless about killing our sleeping sailors at Pearl Harbor, still seemed like real people. And, from a different perspective, consider the portrayal of the Nazis in "Schindler's List." From backslapping, good-old-boy Nazis to the truly psychotic SS camp commander Amon Goeth, I found them all to be realistic, believable characters (as frightful as he was, Goeth nonetheless came off looking horrifyingly realistic). Just imagine what an awful dud "Schindler's List" would have been if Goeth had instead come off looking cartoonish, a simple caricature of a typical Nazi SS thug? But, back to the central point: just where is the line that must not be crossed? At what point does a character go from being realistic to being cartoonish? I don't know - but I can sure tell when I see it.
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Post by sageuk on Jun 5, 2010 8:56:52 GMT -5
For for one thing, less "MUHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA" from the samurai, particularly WACKY-zaka (my nickname for him because of the actor's over the top performance). Judging on your analysis on things, I think the one Japanese who is closest to human would be Konishi, because of his initial reluctance to fight, though I may be wrong.
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Post by firearrow on Jun 5, 2010 13:14:08 GMT -5
Maybe, how Koreans depict their oppressors is unlike Westerners. It seems the "bad guys" in Korean historical dramas have very apparent flaws: their manical, over confident, physically abusive, etc. Being an oppressor is not as simple as wearing a black hat, or a white hat. As for those wacky Japanese, I took some of their mannerisms to be-- because you can be as lax, or over the top, when you think you are the superior.
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Post by mikey on Jun 6, 2010 22:47:29 GMT -5
There could be some truth to what you say. Korean drams sure do have more than their share of over-the-top characters (especially the "Evil Mother-In-Law" that shows up in nearly every Korean daily drama show). ;D
But . . . occasionally a gem does come along. The best recent example might be the evil Mishil in "Great Queen Seondeok." Mishil is power-hungry and ruthless, but she's also thoughtful and low-key, and I thought that her wonderfully understated performance really stole the show. And, from what I've gathered, native Koreans were as impressed with her as I was.
So, it might not be that Koreans automatically like those over-the-top characters. It might be that they've just gotten used to them over the years.
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Post by ajk on Jun 7, 2010 16:22:55 GMT -5
dramafever said exactly what I'd say. Some of the portrayals of Japanese characters were actually quite good. The only thing that bugged me--and it's the only thing about the whole series I'd fault in the least--was the occasional round of Dick-Dastardly evil laughing from the generals. I mean, all those guys needed were stringly little mustaches to twirl, and some "Drat and double drat!" and you've got the old Wacky Races cartoon. The series was so incredibly good, you wonder why those talented writers, producers, directors, etc. didn't see that for how silly it was.
But it's hardly worth dwelling on when you look at the whole series.
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Post by TheBo on Jun 8, 2010 11:30:23 GMT -5
Amen to that, ajk.
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Post by sageuk on Nov 5, 2010 13:59:28 GMT -5
I expected someone to say something about historical accuracy. I heard this drama has had alot of flack for inaccuracies, particularly Won Gyun, the sinking of the turtle ship, and little Yi Soon Shin being a weak lonely boy, whereas the popular belief was that he led a band of boys playing war games (though it could be an exaggeration to glorify him)
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Post by MTR on Nov 12, 2010 14:36:19 GMT -5
Won Gyun was way off ,the real Won Gyun was cowardly . On the Japanese well they missed it by a country mile . Why is Wakizaka so prominent he only had one run in with Yi and pretty much kept his head down for the rest of the war .All the Samurai Costumes /Armour are wrong ,wrong mon (crest's ),some are 12th century others 19th ,few 16th ,the swords are not worn properly ,the top knots are wrong ,i could go on . The depiction of Hideyoshi is way off ditto Tokugawa Ieyasu . On the Japanese Side Kato and Konishi as well as Kuroda were the main players ,but not from watching this .
Despite all that it is still a great drama and actually very popular in Japan ,
I remember the 2001 Taiga drama Hojo Tokimune about the Mongol Invasions the Korean Govnt was so upset after reading the script with the depiction of the Koryo Court (under the thumb of the Mongols )and that Koryo soldiers were responsible for massacres (true)of Japanese Islanders that they withdrew permission for NHK to film in Korea so they had to use China instead .
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