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Post by kathleen34 on Nov 17, 2005 17:51:29 GMT -5
YIKES... I really wish this whole thing had been discussed via PM ... Having read this thread for a while, I can only say that we are in great need of immeasurable grace ... and correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think we're going to get it from you guys
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Post by Tim on Nov 17, 2005 20:27:02 GMT -5
Too bad for you, Trespasser. Because I HIGHLY doubt that would ever happen. And yes, if that's so, then alot of other countries should be broken down into smaller countries. Aside from the other people's example, I would like to add a few more to show you how ridiculous you sound.
There are a bunch of Ryukyu natives that demands independence from Japan. Also, the Ainus should also have their separate country to govern. America should release Texas (because there really was a country known as Texas) and pretty much all of the western US back to Mexico. Also, Hawaii should be given back to Hawaiins... um... Guam should be given back to the Guams... India would certainly be divided into several more countries.
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generaldu
Senior Addict
The subway charms us so, where balmy breezes blow, to and fro. - Lorenz Hart - "Manhattan"
Posts: 312
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Post by generaldu on Nov 18, 2005 16:15:15 GMT -5
Too bad for you, Trespasser. Because I HIGHLY doubt that would ever happen. And yes, if that's so, then alot of other countries should be broken down into smaller countries. Aside from the other people's example, I would like to add a few more to show you how ridiculous you sound. There are a bunch of Ryukyu natives that demands independence from Japan. Also, the Ainus should also have their separate country to govern. America should release Texas (because there really was a country known as Texas) and pretty much all of the western US back to Mexico. Also, Hawaii should be given back to Hawaiins... um... Guam should be given back to the Guams... India would certainly be divided into several more countries. By all means, I'm for de-accessioning Texas, but in the other cases perhaps we could poll the residents first.
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Post by TheBo on Nov 18, 2005 16:58:07 GMT -5
By all means, I'm for de-accessioning Texas, but in the other cases perhaps we could poll the residents first. ;D ;D ;D Bo
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Post by moreshige unlogged on Nov 19, 2005 3:27:09 GMT -5
Too bad for you, Trespasser. Because I HIGHLY doubt that would ever happen. And yes, if that's so, then alot of other countries should be broken down into smaller countries. Aside from the other people's example, I would like to add a few more to show you how ridiculous you sound. There are a bunch of Ryukyu natives that demands independence from Japan. Also, the Ainus should also have their separate country to govern. America should release Texas (because there really was a country known as Texas) and pretty much all of the western US back to Mexico. Also, Hawaii should be given back to Hawaiins... um... Guam should be given back to the Guams... India would certainly be divided into several more countries. By all means, I'm for de-accessioning Texas, but in the other cases perhaps we could poll the residents first. Good point. Now why didn't everyone think of this before? lol I guess that's what makes Tibet so controversial because these people acutally do want to separate. What I'm curious about is what makes a people want to separate? hmmm this question should be posted in some sociology forum if there are such sites. hahah. Maybe an economics or even poly sci forum could also answer. What I may say might be controversial...(strictly from a cultural point of view) some so-called 'cultures' only have regional differences like people from Tex-as vs people from New Yawk. I guess my question is does that make it a distinct 'culture' ? My humble opinion is that one would need time/history and evolution to factor into that equation. Gven enough time and isolation which is also key, I bet Texans would become an entirely different culture. But in a couple of centuries and I bet if history doesn't forget, the ol US of A would have the right to lay its shared origins with the Texans.
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Post by moreshige unlogged on Nov 19, 2005 4:22:47 GMT -5
I don't want to be controversial....but do white americans or even black americans today identify themselves as strict cultural descendants of European and African cultures rather than just by their race? For example, let's take Jay Leno as a social experiment. We all know that he's both 'Scottish' and 'Italian', (multicultural european ancestors) like many typical Americans. But had he not informed the public that his parents were Scottish and Italian would we know that he is either one from strictly a cultural point of view? I doubt it. He's cultrually 'American' than anything else. When I was in the army, my drill instructors in my platoon told us to find partners of the same race. We had to raise our hands whenever they called out each of the minorties. "All the black soldiers, raise your hands", the instructors would say. Then the Latinos, then the Asians...And finally they even asked if there were any Native Americans. We had thought no one would raise their hand until this blue-eyed blond young lady stood up. You can imagine all the incredulous looks on everyone's faces by now. But the gal just simply explained she was one tenth cheerokee Indian...lol (picture everyone's eyes rolling...) With Asian-Americans and similarly with Latinos the question of assimilation is a little bit complicated because relatively we've been americans for a shorter time...maybe up to the third or fourth generation at most (I dont know, Im not a sociologist) And more or less we've been resistent to the melting pot ideology for various reasons. For example, not being fully accepted as true-blood Americans on racial and socio-cultural grounds vs legal grounds. It's eaiser to be accepted as an American legally than anything else. There's also added pressure to be culturally Asian as well. And depending on the individual these social pressures can be both a blessing and a curse. I'm sorry if I offend anyone, this last part comes from personal experience. Man, I could go on forever about this...lol I'm the king of tangents and terrible segways! And now back to Gengis Khan everybody!
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Post by Tim on Nov 19, 2005 14:38:43 GMT -5
Erm... ok. Lol. There are many reasons why people would want to separate. I could go on forever, but let's just leave it at that. A better question would be: Do the people WANT to separate? Let's look at UK and Ireland. The Irish people wants the whole island to be free of British rule. But the people of North Ireland wants to remain under British rule. Technically speaking, the whole Ireland should have their independence, because the Celtic people populated Ireland long before teh British did. But the thing is, North Ireland doesn't want independence, which is why the IRA is so pissed off at.
Now, Tibet may declare independence, but less and less of them want it. I'm not saying it is right for China to take over Tibet, but I'm just saying, what if the Tibetans one day just don't want independence? Same goes for the other minority tribes. What if they just don't want independence? Is this a subject so strict that we have to force them to have the idea of wanting independence? Just something I think we should all think about.
As for Genghis Khan... it didn't broadcast here in US. I don't know anything about the show, lol. But perhaps we should quit this talk before anyone else (mostl likely me) lose control again.
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Post by moreshige unlogged on Nov 19, 2005 14:55:17 GMT -5
Erm... ok. Lol. There are many reasons why people would want to separate. I could go on forever, but let's just leave it at that. A better question would be: Do the people WANT to separate? Let's look at UK and Ireland. The Irish people wants the whole island to be free of British rule. But the people of North Ireland wants to remain under British rule. Technically speaking, the whole Ireland should have their independence, because the Celtic people populated Ireland long before teh British did. But the thing is, North Ireland doesn't want independence, which is why the IRA is so pissed off at. Now, Tibet may declare independence, but less and less of them want it. I'm not saying it is right for China to take over Tibet, but I'm just saying, what if the Tibetans one day just don't want independence? Same goes for the other minority tribes. What if they just don't want independence? Is this a subject so strict that we have to force them to have the idea of wanting independence? Just something I think we should all think about. As for Genghis Khan... it didn't broadcast here in US. I don't know anything about the show, lol. But perhaps we should quit this talk before anyone else (mostl likely me) lose control again. Yes, I would agree with your arguments about the Irish if we were to strictly view it from a cultural standpoint. But it's more complicated than that. From my limited knowledge, I understood their division was largely religious as well. Northern Irish were mostly rich protestant land holders largely associated with the church of England. While Ireland proper, the people were mostly disenfranchised poor catholics. From this viewpoint I can see why Northern Ireland would want to 'stay' with England.
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Post by skinz on Nov 19, 2005 17:30:29 GMT -5
I don't want to be controversial....but do white americans or even black americans today identify themselves as strict cultural descendants of European and African cultures rather than just by their race? Well speaking as a black man, I don't know a thing about Africa to know any cultural info on it. My ancestors came from africa (like many black folks) but with such movement over the centuries with slavery and colonialism by european nations, many old african tribes and cultures have died out. (I could be a descendant of a royal king for all I know). That's why I envy countries with long history like Iraq, Egypt, China, Japan, Korea, and etc. There are 1,000 of years to learn about what your ancestors was in that time. Most blacks from America, West Indies, and South America can only go back to the 17th century for our whole family tree. I can see how Tibet and other small nations want to be free because their culture can easily die out without them noticing it. Exchanging old customs for a brand new car and a cell phone have killed millions of old cultures.
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Post by Tim on Nov 20, 2005 1:45:59 GMT -5
I don't want to be controversial....but do white americans or even black americans today identify themselves as strict cultural descendants of European and African cultures rather than just by their race? Well speaking as a black man, I don't know a thing about Africa to know any cultural info on it. My ancestors came from africa (like many black folks) but with such movement over the centuries with slavery and colonialism by european nations, many old african tribes and cultures have died out. (I could be a descendant of a royal king for all I know). That's why I envy countries with long history like Iraq, Egypt, China, Japan, Korea, and etc. There are 1,000 of years to learn about what your ancestors was in that time. Most blacks from America, West Indies, and South America can only go back to the 17th century for our whole family tree. I can see how Tibet and other small nations want to be free because their culture can easily die out without them noticing it. Exchanging old customs for a brand new car and a cell phone have killed millions of old cultures. Yeah, I see what you mean. It's just a shame alot of old cultures have disappeared. Many minority tribes in China are suffering the same fate. The Manchurian culture is definitely dead. It started to die when the Manchurians took over China and decided to learn the Han culture, and not spread out their own.
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Post by Trespasser on Nov 23, 2005 22:02:37 GMT -5
Enough with anti-Chinese rant.
Genghis Khan really is a great series, the series really takes off after Episode 18. The battles scenes are spectacular and incredible to watch. You care simply blown away by the sheer scale of drama; it reminds you of Braveheart or The Gladiator.
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Post by Tim on Nov 24, 2005 0:55:45 GMT -5
Enough with anti-Chinese rant. Yes, Trespasser. In fact, we probably shouldn't even be talking about stuff like this. This is, after all, a Korean drama site, not a site dedicating to see who's political view is right. I didn't see the drama, so I don't know how good (or bad) it is, but I suppose if they do air the drama (which they most likely will not), I would like to give it a shot.
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