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Post by luvswarriors on Apr 6, 2005 22:29:48 GMT -5
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Post by TheBo on Apr 7, 2005 11:04:06 GMT -5
Aigu. I do want everyone to note that there are dissenting voices in Japan, as noted in this article. Not everyone is on this bandwagon; not everyone thinks it's a good idea; it's a conservative movement. Not that it should not be watched.
Bo
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Post by florel on Apr 7, 2005 16:27:44 GMT -5
It's a sad reality that history has not been free from the actual political situation and power games. It's also regrettable that the right wing politicians in Japan are as stupid as Korean politicians (both South and North). What can we learn from history ? I would like to cite Yu Sung-Ryong's words from the preface of "The Book of Corrections", his war memory book. The Book of Odes (Shijing) says, "I will try to correct the mistakes of the past in order to prevent disasters in the future." This is why I decided to publish this record. As a man of little ability, I took upon myself serious responsibility of the state at the most difficult moment and failed in my duty to rectify the problems and restore the peace. My mistakes cannot be forgiven even by the death. ... [Yu Sung-Ryong, The Book of Corrections, Engl. trans., Berkeley, 2002, p. 15.] Yu Sung-Ryong was a rare politican who had a moral sense. Actually, "The diplomatic wars" between two nations continue in U.N. and in other places. But the show must go on... Kabuki plays in Korea
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Post by luvarchfiend on Apr 7, 2005 22:09:18 GMT -5
if only there were more who had that moral sense.
i don't see how sugar-coating history will help anyone. i don't think anything can be learned if the mistakes aren't presented in truth and full disclosure.
yes, it is painful to look back at the events...but to ignore them diminishes the suffering they caused and prevents constructive and correct analysis, hindering positive change.
the truth and events cannot be changed, they shouldn't be written as such.
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Post by skinz on Apr 8, 2005 12:39:12 GMT -5
I wonder what both side are really after? They have to be something more to it if their really blowing this stuff up. Could it be that their using this stuff to change public attention to something else while planning on something devious behind the scenes?
I highly recommend Hirohito: And the making of Modern Japan by Herbert P. Bix.
I'm reading it now and I must say this is the best historical book I've read so far. If you really want to know how Japanese conservative really think, this book will shock you. Its basically a biography of Emperor Hirohito but covers the events that were happening at the time. From Hirohito's educational studies and the changes the educational system made in order for loyal support for the imperial family in the early 1920s, The rise of the military in the 1930s, to the mentality they have in regards to korea, China, and the rest of Asia.
After this I'm gonna look for some info on Korean conservative outlook and ideology. Any recommendations?
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Post by TheBo on Apr 8, 2005 13:19:40 GMT -5
...I highly recommend Hirohito: And the making of Modern Japan by Herbert P. Blix. ... After this I'm gonna look for some info on Korean conservative outlook and ideology. Any recommendations? Never one to accept people's recomendations on face value, skinz, I googled Mr. Blix and came up with an interesting website--you may be familiar with it: www.japanreview.net/about_this_site.htmIt is a site dedicated to reviewing of and essays about books on Japan. It is run by two financial people, so, not having explored it too much yet, I assume the bent is somewhat conservative. (I believe we should always look for the ideological bias of anything or anyone we read, to have all the information, that is the only reason I mention this.) Unfortunately, the reason Blix came up there was that someone was complaining they had not reviewed his books, but it is a source for other books about Japan. Bo
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Post by TheBo on Apr 8, 2005 13:32:19 GMT -5
skinz! His name is BIX. Herbert P. Bix.
Did a boolean on ABEbooks for "Hirohito" and "making" to bring the title up.
Now I can search for info.
Bo
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Post by florel on Apr 8, 2005 13:46:07 GMT -5
Interesting book info, skinz. I would like to order this book when I will purchase some English books next time. (But it will take a few months, helas !) As I don't have the book now, I googled and found an interesting webpage www.jpri.org/publications/workingpapers/wp92.htmlAnd from the Oxford site : 9. Compare Herbert Bix, Hirohito and the Making of Modern Japan (Harper Collins, 2000) and Steven Large, Emperor Hirohito and Showa Japan: A Political Biography (Routledge, 1992). Why was Emperor Hirohito such a controversial historical subject? What are the main differences between the perspectives presented by Bix and Large, and how would you account for them? In addition to providing some divergent view of Hirohito himself, how do these biographies differ in what they say about the history of modern Japan more generally? www.oxfordjapan.org/papertopics.html
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Post by florel on Apr 8, 2005 14:29:35 GMT -5
Personally, I would like to read and compare books of Bix and Large. It would be interesting.
It seems to me that Koreans don't consider Hirohito as a Japanese Hitler, but they consider the whole Japanese militarists (in collective) as a peer of Nazi.
My grandparents lived under the reign of Hirohito. They survived from this dark period and from the Korean War. (Thanks Providnece !)
According to the Japanese government's official record, 1,519,142 Koreans were drafted as workers or soldiers between 1939-1945 for the empire's military glory. (This record concerns for oversea draft. ) Most of them never returned. At the same moment, the Japanese common people also suffered in order to support the warfare of their own country.
My father was born in 1939 when Korean language was prohibited by the Japanese government. Japanese militarists also forced to change Koreans' names into Japanese ones. They wanted to melt away Korean people and Korean culture. Language and names are the spirit of an independant culture. Fortunately it didn't continue long. Koreans could have been another Tibetan.
We don't want to the repetition of the tragedic past. I wish our neighbor could cooperate with other Asians for constructing positive future. But the actual attitude of Japan doesn't gain confidence by her neighbors. It's the problem.
By the way, will Japan have an empress in the future ? Hopefully...
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Post by TheBo on Apr 8, 2005 14:49:25 GMT -5
Florel, forgive me for being dull-headed, but are you saying this happened to your family in Korea during the Japanese occupation of Korea, or that your family was forced to live in Japan? I guess I'm really just trying to get your family's particular history straight.
Your comment that language and names are the spirit of an independent culture is certainly true. The American and Canadian governments tried to erase the native cultures by sending their children to be educated in boarding schools and not allowing them to speak or learn about their language, but that did not fully succeed, thankfully. (To be sure, the people who did this mostly believed they were helping those children by forcing them to give up their "primitivism.") Unfortunately, many native American tribespeople believe this is one of the reasons for many of the problems of the tribes and nations, such as loss of hope and community.
Bo
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Post by florel on Apr 8, 2005 15:17:02 GMT -5
I didn't tell my family's particular history related to the draft policy. If you want to know... A brother of my grandmother (mother of my mother) was forcibly sent to Japan as a worker during WWII. He couldn't (or didn't) return after the War (for some reasons I don't know). His children are living in Japan and they don't speak Korean. My two grandmothers don't speak Japanese but they understand it. My father speaks perfect Japanese and even Japaneses think sometimes he is their compatriot. But it's odd that he was only 5 years old when Korea was liberated. I guess its by his personal effort that he could obtain his excellent linguistic capacity. Actually, 700,000 Koreans are living in Japan and they have been despised by the Japanese. Only recently Yon Sama (Bae Yong-Jun) largely contributed to change Koreans' image in Japan and to improve the relation of two countries. Cheers for Yon Sama !
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Post by florel on Apr 8, 2005 15:40:48 GMT -5
Your comment that language and names are the spirit of an independent culture is certainly true. The American and Canadian governments tried to erase the native cultures by sending their children to be educated in boarding schools and not allowing them to speak or learn about their language, but that did not fully succeed, thankfully. (To be sure, the people who did this mostly believed they were helping those children by forcing them to give up their "primitivism.") Unfortunately, many native American tribespeople believe this is one of the reasons for many of the problems of the tribes and nations, such as loss of hope and community. Bo I think language forms the identity of a community and of a nation. It contains the whole history of them. We need to study a standard national language and a standard international language. But it doesn't signify we have to reject other native one. But, everywhere in the World, the linguistic centralist policy has forced to eliminate regional or minor languages. The linguistic centralism is also attested in Europe and lots of dialects have been disappeared and are disappearing. An Italian boy told me that this happens in Italy especially by the influence of mass-media. In France, it was by the central government's policy. But from recent days, I heard, there are regional movements to revivify their dialects. Bretons in Brittany or Provencals in Provence are not as desesperated as American Indians. But they want to regain their own languages, unfortunately having been reduced more and more.
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Post by skinz on Apr 8, 2005 15:56:56 GMT -5
skinz! His name is BIX. Herbert P. Bix. Did a boolean on ABEbooks for "Hirohito" and "making" to bring the title up. Now I can search for info. Bo Oops! fingers slipped. Thanks for the correction. I just read 100+ into it and so far I'm just in awe. Also Mr. Bix work won the Pulitzer prize and is a New York Times Notable Book. I'll come back with some info(and trust me there's a lot). I can't put this book down. I might have to miss a YSS episode.;D
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Post by TheBo on Apr 8, 2005 16:04:58 GMT -5
A brother of my grandmother (mother of my mother) was forcibly sent to Japan as a worker during WWII. He couldn't (or didn't) return after the War (for some reasons I don't know). His children are living in Japan and they don't speak Korean. ... Actually, 700,000 Koreans are living in Japan and they have been despised by the Japanese. ... I had heard that many Korean-Japanese were living in Japan, even many generations, and are despised by the Japanese. This made me very, very sad. I have a question--do you think that Korean people had a similar attitude after the War toward their returned prisoners as the people did in YSS? Or, perhaps, that the prisoners would have believed they would be treated badly because they were captured? It just seems odd that so many people who were forced to go to Japan would just stay there instead of going home. (Of course, there are always those who married and want to stay for that reason.) I absolutely agree with your assessment on the importance of dialect and language, and I think you'd find a lot of linguists and historians who also agree with you. Probably the biggest modern culprit is television. Here in the US, for instance, regional differences are evaporating at a frightening rate. If you erase differences, there's less to fight about, but let's face it, people will fight with each other no matter what. Let's embrace our differences and respect them. Oh, oh. Here I go with my crazy hippie talk again. LOL. Bo
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Post by florel on Apr 8, 2005 16:46:07 GMT -5
I had heard that many Korean-Japanese were living in Japan, even many generations, and are despised by the Japanese. This made me very, very sad. I have a question--do you think that Korean people had a similar attitude after the War toward their returned prisoners as the people did in YSS? Or, perhaps, that the prisoners would have believed they would be treated badly because they were captured? It just seems odd that so many people who were forced to go to Japan would just stay there instead of going home. (Of course, there are always those who married and want to stay for that reason.) Firstly, lots of Korean drafted soldiers and workers died in Japan or in Southeast Asia. Secondly, I guess, many drafted workers stayed in Japan, especially by the financial reason. No money to come back. But when they earned it, they probably found themselves firmly rooted in Japansese soil (family, house, job, etc.). Korean drafted workers were not blamed by Koreans. Some of Korean drafted soldiers (especially officers) have been reproached by Koreans as war criminals and Japanese dogs. But not all of them. But the situation was completely different for Korean women sex slaves. They were treated as Chohee (Mijin's daughter) in the drama. So they hided their past until recent days. After they returned, some of them got married but were divorced when their past was revealed. It's lamentable that our compatriots were not tolerant to these poor women.
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