Info - Chosun army and militia leaders

[ginnycat5]

thebo said:

Ah, okay. Now, lemmee see, for our non-jargon-speaking viewers (LOL)--EWG is Emperor Wang Guhn, DOE (DOW! Hah!) is Dawn of Empire, and AOW is Age of Warriors. I wonder why they abandoned the project. I thought it was really well done, I was enjoying what I could catch of it.



Bo

What was the series before Emperor Wang Gun? I first caught it late at night --there was a woman and a little boy escaping an armed attack. The boy was cut across the eye and the woman was mortally wounded. Before she died she said, I am your mother. He grew up to be kind of a monk (?), but also the king, with an eye patch. He was a good king for a while, but went mad, and his court had to unseat him.

[florel]

florel said:

Kwon Yul participated in the battle of Yong-In as High Constable{*my translation of moksa*} of Gwangju.

At the battle of Ichi, he is often called as "jeol-je-sa" of Cholla province instead of moksa of Gwangju.

What I'm not sure is if Kwon Yul would or would not have received a new title of "jeol-je-sa" of Cholla province after the battle of Yong-In as the show depicts.
The provincial administrator moksa took the military title "jeol-je-sa" at the same time. But there were at least three High Constables in Cholla province, so I'm not sure if "jeol-je-sa" of Cholla province would be something other than "jeol-je-sa" of specific cities. (I'm trying to study about this but I don't have sufficient informations. The military system of Chosun is too complicated ! lol)

Kwon Yul became Governor of Cholla province (gwan-chal-sa aka gam-sa) after the battle of Ichi.

Gen. Kwon Yul's title before the Battle of Ichi was do-jeol-je-sa. He obtained this promotion before Ichi Battle as the drama depicts it in Ep. 71. But in the drama and in some infos I found, he is often called just as jeol-je-sa.

Do-jeol-je-sa is a provincial commander whose rank is situated between provincial governor and other jeol-je-sa of important fortresses. (* About jeol-je-sa, please refer to page 1 of this thread.) It's a temporary military title, like do-won-su i.e. Marshal, accorded during war time.

Kwon Yul was promoted to Governor of Cholla province after his victory in Ichi Battle (July 1592).

[florel]

- Yi Kwang (1541-1607)


A member of clan Yi of Duksu (same clan with YSS). Grandson of Left Minister Yi Haeng (1478-1534).

Yi Kwang passed the Examination for civilian official in 1574. He was appointed High Constable of Gilju, then Governor of Ham-kyung province in 1586. (* In the same year, YSS became Captain of Chosan Fort in Ham-kyung province. It's possible that they came to know each other in that period.)

In 1589, he was appointed Governor of Cholla province and offered to YSS a post of his staff officer when YSS had no job after having returned from Chosan Fort. (* YSS was transfered soon to the post of royal messenger. - Episode 36) In winter of the same year, Yi Kwang was discharged from his post because he was not eager in pursuit of Chung Yeo-Rip's comrades and released innocent fellows without kings permission. (Chung Yeo-Rip's Treason Affair and the purge of the Easterners. - Episodes 36-37)

In 1591, he became again Governor of Cholla province. The next year, when the Imjin War broke out and Seoul was fallen into the Japanese hands', he tried to recover the royal capital assembling 50,000 troops in three southern provinces (Cholla, Kyungsang and Chungchong) along with Yun Seon-Gak and Kim Su. But crashed to a huge defeat in the Battle of Yong-in (the 5th-6th June 1592 - Ep. 69).

After the Battles of Ungchi and Ichi (7th-8th July - Ep. 73-74), He was discharged on the 22th July as he was responsible for the defeat at Young-in. Kwon Yul became his successor. Yi Kwang was degraded as a regular soldier (baek-ui-jong-gun), but exiled soon in Autumn 1592. He returned to home in 1594.

[florel]

Kim Eung-Suh (1564-1624, aka Kim Kyung-Suh)

- also spelled as Kim Ung-so


Native of Pyung-an province and a descendant of military families. He passed the Military Examination when he was about twenty years old (circa 1584?), but he couldn't get promotion on military rank and even dismissed without reason because he was a descendant of a modest aristocratic family. He was reinstated in the army after the Imjin War broke out.

Participated in three battles of Pyung-yang between 1592-1593. Commander of the Cholla Army between 1593-1594 and Commander of the Right Kyungsang Army between 1595-1597.

In January 1597, informed by Yoshira, Kim Eung-Suh reported to Marshal Kwon Yul and to the court about Kato Kiyomasa's arrival. YSS was jailed after this incident and the Chosun Navy under the command of Won Kyun was annihilated in the Sea Battle of Chilchonryang in July 1597.

Commander Kim was punished after the Chosun navy's defeat by reason of being deceived by the Japanese. He was degraded and served the army as a soldier (baek ui jong gun like YSS).

Participated in the 1st Battle of Ulsan (22th December 1597 - 4th January 1598) commanding the surrendered Japanese and recorded brilliant achievements. He was reinstated in April 1598.


In 1613, he changed his name as Kim Kyung-Suh, because a man named Pak Eung-Suh was involved in a rebellion plan incident in this year.

Appointed Commander of the North Hamkyung Army in 1616, Commander of the Pyung-an Army in 1618. In this year, he was dispatched to Ming China with Marshal Gang Hong-Rip and 13,000 troops under repeated requests from the Empire in order to fight against the Jurchens (the future Manchus) who invaded Liaodong.

In 1619, Ming armies were crushed in the Battle of Sarhu and the Chosunese army under Ming commander Liu Ting lost two-thirds of his troops at Fuca and surrendered to Nurhaci (1559-1626). In 1620 almost all Korean captives were released except Marshal Gang Hong-rip and Vice-Marshal Kim Eung-Suh.

He died in Shenyang on the 18th April 1624 at the age of 61. He was said to be executed because he tried to send a secret report to Chosun about the situation of Manchu.



Kim Eung-Suh was the commander who was on bad terms with Admiral YSS. They disliked each other.

He is also famous with his love story with Gye-hynag, a Gisaeng woman and Korean Judith. He was said to have killed a Japanese officer under Konishi Yukinaga with Gye-hyang's help.



I was shocked when I saw Kim Eung-Suh in the drama. His love story with Gye-hyang let me imagine him as a young handsome commander. He was only 28 in 1592 and 33 years old in 1597. But the ugly Commander Kim in the drama looks older than YSS in his fifties ! LOL

[captainamazing]

Florel, how do you obtain all this incredible information? I had no idea that so much was known about what seem to be relatively obscure people by today's standards. Chances are I wouldn't understand anything since I can't understand a word of Korean. Keep up the good work!

Having said that, can you explain the difference between the positions of Yi Won-Ik and Kwon Yul? According to your other post, it seems that Yi Won-Ik was the supreme military commander while Kwon Yul was only a marshal. What did Yi Won-Ik do in order to receive such a promotion?

After all, he did lead the failed second attack on Pyongyang while Kwon Yul defended Haenju and Ichi among other things.

[florel]

captainamazing said:

Florel, how do you obtain all this incredible information? I had no idea that so much was known about what seem to be relatively obscure people by today's standards. Chances are I wouldn't understand anything since I can't understand a word of Korean. Keep up the good work!

I received some basic and a little bit professional educations about Korean history when I was in Korea. But I've forgotten many details during ten years. The Korean websites helped me to study Korean history again. But sometimes they gave contradictory or inaccurate infos and there are ongoing historical debates. So I need to "criticize" and "cross-verify" the infos I obtained on web.

If one can read Korean, it's possible to collect a big amount of informations concerning Korean history and the Imjin War on korean web sites. Several of them offer useful infos and some diligent Korean internautes even posted some excerpts of translations of the Royal Chronicles and other primary sources.

About biographies of historical personages, I often refer to Korean Study (han guk hak) sites. About the navy officers, YSS's Diary is the source par excellence.

Thanks for inspiriting me, captain. I also wish contributions on the part of Korean members or guests. I only have limited infos because I cannot get history books written in Korean where I'm living while Koreans in Korea certainly know much better than me on historical subjects.

captainamazing said:

Having said that, can you explain the difference between the positions of Yi Won-Ik and Kwon Yul? According to your other post, it seems that Yi Won-Ik was the supreme military commander while Kwon Yul was only a marshal. What did Yi Won-Ik do in order to receive such a promotion?

After all, he did lead the failed second attack on Pyongyang while Kwon Yul defended Haenju and Ichi among other things.

I think there is a translation problem as Daemado pointed it out in another thread.

When I translated the title chechalsa as Supreme Military Commander, I followed the translation in the English version of YSS's Diary. But, IMO, it's not a good translation.

Chechalsa aka dochechalsa is a kind of administrative inspector about military affairs. (perhaps equivalent to the role of Ishida Mitsunari in Chosun.) We could translate it as Grand Inspector or as Supreme Provincial Commander.

Sometimes a marshal came to be appointed chechalsa at the same time. But during the Imjin War period, the title of chechalsa was taken by the Prime Minister, Left Minister or Right Minister (ex: Yu Sung-Ryong, Yun Du-Su, Yi Won-Ik, Yi Duk-Hyung). So their rank was above dowonsu (Marshal) who was a chief military commander in field.


Yi Won-Ik was not the only one who failed to recover a fortress. Kim Myun was a brilliant commander, but he failed three times to recover Sungju. Marshal Kwon Yul (with the Ming commander Yang Hao) also failed to recover Ulsan Castle in 1597-1598.


In fact, Yi Won-Ik is more famous as a great minister than a military leader. There were four great ministers under the reigns of King Sunjo and Prince Gwanghae : Yu Sung-Ryong, Yi Won-Ik, Yi Duk-Hyung and Yi Hang-Bok. And all of them show up in the drama.

In IYSS, the Chosunse ministers except Yu Sung-Ryong are depicted as a crowd of stupid rats. It's true that they were responsible for bad national defense. But, on the other hand, they worked hard to overcome the national crisis in administrative or diplomatic fields. All of the Chosunese ministers were not corrupt fat rats like Yun Won-Hyung or Yun Du-Su.