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Post by luvarchfiend on Oct 30, 2004 21:26:10 GMT -5
i just saw this episode for the 4th time, first time on tv with the subs.....when the music started i got chills....
what a man! how horrible his choices were! his strength and courage and leadership are amazing. and to cover his emotions so well, and be the leader his men needed to see....a terrible burden that he dealt with so well.
it was awful when he had to fire upon his own countrymen. and how noble of them to sacrifice themselves the way they did.
and when general hwang went down, well aow viewers....did anyone else see a bit of the archfiend in the old guy?
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Post by Aging Warrior on Oct 30, 2004 22:29:01 GMT -5
Hwang did remind me of the archfiend in the end. Since it looks like this series is going to cover the time leading up to this battle, I hope we get to see more of him.
I can't say i like the way Yi Soon Shin is being portrayed. He spends too much time thinking and looking into the distance during the heat of battle and in the middle of personal confrontations. I guess it is supposed to make him look deliberate but he just comes off as disengaged.
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General Hyun ChiWon
Guest
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Post by General Hyun ChiWon on Oct 30, 2004 22:57:55 GMT -5
I didn't see General Hwang as the Archfiend as much as I saw General Du in him.
I thought the first episode was to run for over an hour. Does that mean the MBC has cheated us again?
I could swear that Park Jin-Jae is in the series. I was waching real close and could swear that his face was pictured. Just like I remembered
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Post by TifosoDiCorea on Oct 31, 2004 0:33:14 GMT -5
I was very excited and eager before the start of this series broadcast in NYC, but after seeing the first episode tonight, I was VERY dissapointed I must say. The acting was ok but some of the scenes and dialog just doesn't seem plausible. I mean, a historical drama should be at least beleivable. When Admiral Yi cut the Ming general's throat, I knew this drama was way overboard with its artistic license. The Admiral was a man of principle, discipline, and culture. During that time, Chosun was hosting the Ming forces so the real Admiral Yi would not have insulted his guests with such venom. I know a little about warfare so I spotted so many inaccuracies about the battle scenes that made me question the accuracy of the drama and story. The scene where the Admiral is confronting Konishi's ship, why aren't the Admiral and the crew taking cover!? The japanese were shooting at them with muskets and cannons and they all were all still standing in clear view! When Konishi ordered his men to target Jin LIn's small ship with cannons from the beach, I thought that was a stupid order becuase it is vitually impossible to hit a moving ship from land with the type of cannons that the Japanese had. When aging General Hwang was fighting off a dozen samurais with a heavy axe, I thought I watching a bad kung fu movie. Another thing, the Chinese and Japanese characters were portrayed as caricatures and one-dimensionally. The Ming generals were so buffoonish, I found it distracting. Come on, did the Ming really sent laurel and hardy to fight the biggest threat in Asia? Konishi acted like a Bond villian very time he cursed Admiral Yi! I know it is a Korean production but there should be some balance at least. I was expecting too much, but come on folks, this is is Admiral Yi Soon Shin we're talking about here, the greatest naval leader of all time and he deserves a better production! At least make it realistic and not cartoony. I really hope future episodes will be better. BTW, I really liked the music score...majestic and powerful.
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Post by skinz on Oct 31, 2004 9:39:32 GMT -5
Another thing, the Chinese and Japanese characters were portrayed as caricatures and one-dimensionally. The Ming generals were so buffoonish, I found it distracting. Come on, did the Ming really sent laurel and hardy to fight the biggest threat in Asia? Konishi acted like a Bond villian very time he cursed Admiral Yi! I thought I was the only one. The ming admiral was portrayed like a complete idiot. And when they showed the cut on the ming admiral neck I was practically insulted. The music is also a concern for me also. Sometimes is grand and epic feeling and other times it sounds like a jazz session or a techno remix. Other than that, great series.
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Post by MasterCrabby on Oct 31, 2004 9:59:08 GMT -5
There were some lapses in realism, but I thought the overall conveyance of the mortality and hazard of naval warfare was on target. If it were too much more realistic, I don't think it would be easy to bear. War is so insane, it's a wonder it still enjoys such credibility. The part where they were fishing bodies out of the dark water really brought it home. What a terrifying death to be severely injured and then face drowning. What bothered me was that the cannons would fire, and there was no recoil. That isn't possible, is it?
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Post by velvet inkbrush of YiSoonShin on Oct 31, 2004 13:31:36 GMT -5
if the characters are portrayed somewhat buffoonishly that is because there is some truth
in reading admiral Yi's war diaries, it is quite evident that Chen Lien was a man of quick temper and narrow vision. the story where yi saves chen lien because he foolishly ran into battle was a true story. he even saved chen lien's life right as he died. so if the ming leadership appears rash, stupid and greedy, that is because that is based quite a bit in truth
i mean the war didn't stretch out for 7 years just because the admiral wasn't trying
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Post by luvarchfiend on Oct 31, 2004 14:01:36 GMT -5
AW...disengaged? i didn't see him like that at all. more haunted and pained over knowing what he had to do, and finding the strength to do it.
General HCW....the first epsiode ran 50:18 on the vod, from opening to previews.
so kbs took some creative liberties...this is still a great series.
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Post by velvet inkbrush of YiSoonShin on Oct 31, 2004 14:02:50 GMT -5
when did he visit the grave of general hwang?
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Post by velvet inkbrush of YiSoonShin on Oct 31, 2004 14:04:37 GMT -5
AW
deliberate, i'm not sure that is the intent
and if he spends a lot of time thinking, it is because the decisions he makes are extremely weighty ones. i don't think i would be so quick to make such decisions and if i did, i don't think i would have a heart. he has to choose between individuals and the greater good of the nation. not an easy task in my mind, especially when the sacrifies consist of such brave and honorable people.
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Post by velvet inkbrush of YiSoonShin on Oct 31, 2004 14:06:42 GMT -5
oops might want to mod that out as some have not seen it yet...
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Post by Eowyn on Oct 31, 2004 20:19:10 GMT -5
I didn't see General Hwang as the Archfiend as much as I saw General Du in him. I could swear that Park Jin-Jae is in the series. I was waching real close and could swear that his face was pictured. Just like I remembered Yes, General Hyun, just like dear old General Du! Yeah, there was a guy whose looks favored Jin-jae, but I don't think it was him. Aw, I miss AOW!
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Post by Eowyn on Oct 31, 2004 20:34:51 GMT -5
When Admiral Yi cut the Ming general's throat, I knew this drama was way overboard with its artistic license. The Admiral was a man of principle, discipline, and culture. During that time, Chosun was hosting the Ming forces so the real Admiral Yi would not have insulted his guests with such venom. But the Admiral's right hand did say to him something like - that was not like you, Admiral - thereby giving us viewers a sense of how out of keeping that particular incident was for Admiral Yi's nature.
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Post by velvet inkbrush of YiSoonShin on Oct 31, 2004 22:46:32 GMT -5
actually, admiral yi and chen lien argued bitterly right up until the end of the war. another fact from his war diaries
which you can incidentally buy at hanbooks.com
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Post by Tepyoung on Nov 4, 2004 20:01:55 GMT -5
Has anyone wondered why severed heads were a desirable bribe? In Episode 1, Korean viewers apparently were shown some explanation, but without a translation for us non-Koreans. During the scene when the Japanese emissary offered a thousand heads as a bribe to the Ming general, at the bottom of the screen were two Chinese characters together with their Korean pronunciation ( su geub I think the modern romanization would be) and a string of Korean phonetic syllables ( hangeul), presumably an explanation. I cannot translate the hangeul, but I can report that the two Chinese characters mean both (1) severed heads, and (2) "a step in rank given to soldiers who bring in such heads" (Mathews' Chinese-English Dictionary entry 5839.28). Severed heads mean promotion. Spare yourself the dangers of war: throw the battle and collect a thousand heads toward promotion in rank, all without risk! Who counted the heads, I wonder? Did the Ming court send accountants along with each army? Or were the heads salted and physically transported all the way back to the Ming capital before the head count was taken — or officially confirmed, anyway? Inasmuch as the heads offered by the Japanese were more likely to be Korean than Japanese, I infer that the Ming head-counters could not distinguish Japanese heads from Korean heads!
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