Post by ajk on Apr 9, 2016 1:29:32 GMT -5
Note: This thread is only for Episode 24. I'll start a separate thread so that people can comment about the series as a whole.
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Interested to know what other people thought of this episode....because maybe it was just me, but I absolutely loved it. In fact I thought it was the best final episode of any historical I've watched. Some of them have been big letdowns but this one was just the opposite. It was put together perfectly--just the right tone of finality but without being too sad. (Credit the soundtrack for part of that; some great choices of background music.) Good ideas in the writing, which we haven't always seen in the series, and none of the silliness that we've seen. And a terrific epilogue.
The way it handled the rest of JYS's life was clever. Apparently nothing is known about what happened to him after his dismissal, except that he may have died during King Sejo's reign (7th king). Which seems sort of strange, that someone so talented and so well-known would just vanish. The way this episode presented it, okay sure why not? The prolonged mental/psychological shock, It may or may not be correct, we'll never know, but it's certainly plausible. And then the sketchbook showing up again after so long, and how it started pulling his mind back into coherence, great idea. And the ending, I don't need to see a happy ending but it was nice that he and Sohyeon would get to spend their final years together after everything they had been through. Very sweet.
The tilting device, that was a good piece of writing, especially referring back to the crowd-mob scene from two episodes earlier and how JYS realized the complications the king faced on the issue of liberating slaves. I appreciated that we got both sides of the issue. Sejong wrestling with the whole condemning-an-innocent-person dilemma, we've seen that kind of thing before in other historicals; far from original but it was presented well. And it was neat to hear Ha Yeon describe JYS's accomplishments as "miraculous." He certainly wasn't an ally in the beginning, but the way he gradually came around to appreciate the value of JYS's work, it's good character development to see someone gradually change like that.
Sejong's final scene, staring at the Okru clock and wondering if he had completed his life's work yet, it was beautifully done--much better than the end of GKS. We didn't see his death like I was hoping we would but what we got was very appropriate for this series. (By the way, JYS getting flogged, this series was consistent with GKS except there he got the full 100, there was no discount for mouthy scholars.)
When they jumped forward and we saw Hwang Hui and Ha Yeon talking about the crown prince being too young and Prince Suyang doing something stupid, well, I knew nothing about events after Sejong's death so I looked it all up. Here it is in case anybody else also didn't know. The two princes we saw in this series were Sejong's first two sons. The first son succeeded Sejong (King Munjong, 5th king). He died at a young age, and his own first son was given the throne as a young boy (King Danjong, 6th king), with regents to assist him. This is where we were in time when Ha Yeon said the crown prince is too young. But Sejong's second son--that's Prince Suyang--he staged a coup soon afterwards and took the throne for himself (became King Sejo, 7th king).
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munjong_of_Joseon
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danjong_of_Joseon
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sejo_of_Joseon
Interesting symbolism, Sejo shoving the tilting device. And him torturing and killing all of those scholars, yes he did:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_martyred_ministers
Then to top it all off we get the surprise flashback of Sejong's visit, which was beautiful. Sejong saying "I want to carry you on my back and dance," not sure if it was deliberate but it made me think of the young JYS being forced to carry the little rich kids on his back, and now look at what the king of the whole country is saying to him.
And then at the very end we finally learn what the heck JYS was doing at the start of the first episode, an old man staggering around in the middle of nowhere. How fitting, he was heading for the shadow of totality at the center of another eclipse. Kind of sad that he would have died out there all alone, but he certainly died happy, didn't he. To bring that back at the very end and reveal the purpose, it was wonderful.
Just a couple of small gripes. One is the again with the pendulum reference; already talked about that before. The other was the flogging--who were those guys doing the flogging? Awfully weak and unimposing. Same deal with the guys torturing the scholars in the epilogue. We always see beefy soldiers carrying out torture in these historicals. Smallish-looking officials in blue robes? Made it hard to take the scenes seriously.
Oh and one oops that might have confused people: Sohyeon saying at the end that she and JYS would observe "the sun, the moon and the seven planets." At that time the so-called "seven planets" included the moon and the sun, plus the five planets that could be seen with the naked eye. So she misspoke or it was mistranslated, but no there were not two additional surprise planets revealed in the final episode.
A few other notes I made:
--When they were taking JYS to the flogging, anybody else get a Jesus vibe? I dismissed it until the guards started pushing him, which wasn't necessary at all, and then it seemed like an odd coincidence. The justification for it--that Sejong wanted the people to remember him--ugh seems pretty weak. Hmmm, not sure that scene was necessary or helpful....
--The narration told us that after Sejong's death, people called him "the Yao and Shun of the East." Had never heard that but this helps explain it a little.
books.google.com/books?id=s2EVi-MpnUsC&pg=PA190&lpg=PA190&dq=%22king+sejong%22+yao+shun&source=bl&ots=sv1fOK8Vow&sig=USRpNxg10RHDyJTQf7XBihe7_XQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjskom29oDMAhXFNiYKHQ_VDLYQ6AEIHDAA#v=onepage&q=%22king%20sejong%22%20yao%20shun&f=false
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emperor_Yao
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emperor_Shun
--Question: Just for a few moments we saw a scene with a proclamation from Sejong publicly posted. It said he had been sick and was "worried" so he was pardoning criminals. Is that something a king would do back then? It was a critical part of the story--I guess that's what allowed JYS to end up at the place Seokgu apparently owned, rather than still being in jail--but there was no narration or dialogue to explain what was going on.
--Have to give credit to whoever prepared JYS's sketchbook. What a beautiful prop. Somebody put a ton of work into creating all of the elaborate drawings and beautiful calligraphy in it.
Finally...I tried very hard to find the 1983 "History of Science and Technology" article that the narration mentioned at the end...but no luck. Apparently it was a Japanese publication but I guess it was never translated into English. Really wanted to look into it because if it's accurate and properly researched, the conclusion that Joseon produced 34 of the 80 most significant 15th century scientific achievements...wow that is absolutely staggering. A great find by whoever turned up that article--it really drives home just how much Sejong and his successors accomplished. Almost incomprehensible, so much from one little country.
Apologies for this being such a long post, but the episode was just so packed full of things that needed mentioning. For all of the ups and downs this series had...like I said, maybe it's just me but I thought the finale was a real gem.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Interested to know what other people thought of this episode....because maybe it was just me, but I absolutely loved it. In fact I thought it was the best final episode of any historical I've watched. Some of them have been big letdowns but this one was just the opposite. It was put together perfectly--just the right tone of finality but without being too sad. (Credit the soundtrack for part of that; some great choices of background music.) Good ideas in the writing, which we haven't always seen in the series, and none of the silliness that we've seen. And a terrific epilogue.
The way it handled the rest of JYS's life was clever. Apparently nothing is known about what happened to him after his dismissal, except that he may have died during King Sejo's reign (7th king). Which seems sort of strange, that someone so talented and so well-known would just vanish. The way this episode presented it, okay sure why not? The prolonged mental/psychological shock, It may or may not be correct, we'll never know, but it's certainly plausible. And then the sketchbook showing up again after so long, and how it started pulling his mind back into coherence, great idea. And the ending, I don't need to see a happy ending but it was nice that he and Sohyeon would get to spend their final years together after everything they had been through. Very sweet.
The tilting device, that was a good piece of writing, especially referring back to the crowd-mob scene from two episodes earlier and how JYS realized the complications the king faced on the issue of liberating slaves. I appreciated that we got both sides of the issue. Sejong wrestling with the whole condemning-an-innocent-person dilemma, we've seen that kind of thing before in other historicals; far from original but it was presented well. And it was neat to hear Ha Yeon describe JYS's accomplishments as "miraculous." He certainly wasn't an ally in the beginning, but the way he gradually came around to appreciate the value of JYS's work, it's good character development to see someone gradually change like that.
Sejong's final scene, staring at the Okru clock and wondering if he had completed his life's work yet, it was beautifully done--much better than the end of GKS. We didn't see his death like I was hoping we would but what we got was very appropriate for this series. (By the way, JYS getting flogged, this series was consistent with GKS except there he got the full 100, there was no discount for mouthy scholars.)
When they jumped forward and we saw Hwang Hui and Ha Yeon talking about the crown prince being too young and Prince Suyang doing something stupid, well, I knew nothing about events after Sejong's death so I looked it all up. Here it is in case anybody else also didn't know. The two princes we saw in this series were Sejong's first two sons. The first son succeeded Sejong (King Munjong, 5th king). He died at a young age, and his own first son was given the throne as a young boy (King Danjong, 6th king), with regents to assist him. This is where we were in time when Ha Yeon said the crown prince is too young. But Sejong's second son--that's Prince Suyang--he staged a coup soon afterwards and took the throne for himself (became King Sejo, 7th king).
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munjong_of_Joseon
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danjong_of_Joseon
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sejo_of_Joseon
Interesting symbolism, Sejo shoving the tilting device. And him torturing and killing all of those scholars, yes he did:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_martyred_ministers
Then to top it all off we get the surprise flashback of Sejong's visit, which was beautiful. Sejong saying "I want to carry you on my back and dance," not sure if it was deliberate but it made me think of the young JYS being forced to carry the little rich kids on his back, and now look at what the king of the whole country is saying to him.
And then at the very end we finally learn what the heck JYS was doing at the start of the first episode, an old man staggering around in the middle of nowhere. How fitting, he was heading for the shadow of totality at the center of another eclipse. Kind of sad that he would have died out there all alone, but he certainly died happy, didn't he. To bring that back at the very end and reveal the purpose, it was wonderful.
Just a couple of small gripes. One is the again with the pendulum reference; already talked about that before. The other was the flogging--who were those guys doing the flogging? Awfully weak and unimposing. Same deal with the guys torturing the scholars in the epilogue. We always see beefy soldiers carrying out torture in these historicals. Smallish-looking officials in blue robes? Made it hard to take the scenes seriously.
Oh and one oops that might have confused people: Sohyeon saying at the end that she and JYS would observe "the sun, the moon and the seven planets." At that time the so-called "seven planets" included the moon and the sun, plus the five planets that could be seen with the naked eye. So she misspoke or it was mistranslated, but no there were not two additional surprise planets revealed in the final episode.
A few other notes I made:
--When they were taking JYS to the flogging, anybody else get a Jesus vibe? I dismissed it until the guards started pushing him, which wasn't necessary at all, and then it seemed like an odd coincidence. The justification for it--that Sejong wanted the people to remember him--ugh seems pretty weak. Hmmm, not sure that scene was necessary or helpful....
--The narration told us that after Sejong's death, people called him "the Yao and Shun of the East." Had never heard that but this helps explain it a little.
books.google.com/books?id=s2EVi-MpnUsC&pg=PA190&lpg=PA190&dq=%22king+sejong%22+yao+shun&source=bl&ots=sv1fOK8Vow&sig=USRpNxg10RHDyJTQf7XBihe7_XQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjskom29oDMAhXFNiYKHQ_VDLYQ6AEIHDAA#v=onepage&q=%22king%20sejong%22%20yao%20shun&f=false
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emperor_Yao
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emperor_Shun
--Question: Just for a few moments we saw a scene with a proclamation from Sejong publicly posted. It said he had been sick and was "worried" so he was pardoning criminals. Is that something a king would do back then? It was a critical part of the story--I guess that's what allowed JYS to end up at the place Seokgu apparently owned, rather than still being in jail--but there was no narration or dialogue to explain what was going on.
--Have to give credit to whoever prepared JYS's sketchbook. What a beautiful prop. Somebody put a ton of work into creating all of the elaborate drawings and beautiful calligraphy in it.
Finally...I tried very hard to find the 1983 "History of Science and Technology" article that the narration mentioned at the end...but no luck. Apparently it was a Japanese publication but I guess it was never translated into English. Really wanted to look into it because if it's accurate and properly researched, the conclusion that Joseon produced 34 of the 80 most significant 15th century scientific achievements...wow that is absolutely staggering. A great find by whoever turned up that article--it really drives home just how much Sejong and his successors accomplished. Almost incomprehensible, so much from one little country.
Apologies for this being such a long post, but the episode was just so packed full of things that needed mentioning. For all of the ups and downs this series had...like I said, maybe it's just me but I thought the finale was a real gem.