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Post by florel on Feb 14, 2005 19:21:23 GMT -5
It looks like America had testy relations with both Britain and France shortly after achieving independence, though. You evoke Citizen Genet Affair and following military and political tensions with french revolutionary governments. It's an exemplary case of the fact that {sadly} there is neither an eternal enemy nor an eternal friend in international relations. At any way, traditionally, America was never a main enemy of France. She had hold great hostility towards the United Kingdom or Germany in the past. Nowadays, the french government object to the American international policy because she has her own interest in the Middle East. I look in a nature of politics and politicians. Sometimes I even have a suspicion that politicans and mass-media encourage anti (french or american) sentiments for political purposes.
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Post by ID on Feb 14, 2005 19:27:36 GMT -5
Saddam Hussein and other Arab leaders bribed Europeon leaders. Took you how many years to figure it out?
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Post by florel on Feb 14, 2005 19:42:04 GMT -5
Oh, ID, all the frenchmen and many foreigners know Jacques Chirac is a corrupted politician. He was also bribed in his own country. My french friends deplored when they were obliged to vote for Chirac against more terrible Le Pen. I would feel the same sentiment when I have to vote to a korean politician. (I've never had an opportunity to vote during ten years because Korean government does not permit a vote to overseas Koreans.)
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Post by florel on Feb 15, 2005 7:59:49 GMT -5
In addition to my previous posting...
The real principal issue is crude oil and petroleum.
Why does the U.S. send military troops to Iraq ?
- Official position : to destroy nuclear weapons in Iraq and for peace in the World. - Real intention : For oil.
Why does France oppose the U.S.?
- Official position : objection to a military expedition without proof and without international approval etc. - Real intention : For oil.
Why does Korea send also her soldiers to Iraq ?
- Official position : because of friendship with the U. S. and for peace in the World. - Real intention : For fear of the withdrawl of American troops in KoreaA and with a hope to get some economical profits.
Politics are disgusting....
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generaldu
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Post by generaldu on Feb 15, 2005 9:04:02 GMT -5
In addition to my previous posting... The real principal issue is crude oil and petroleum. Why does the U.S. send military troops to Iraq ? - Official position : to destroy nuclear weapons in Iraq and for peace in the World. - Real intention : For oil. Why does France oppose the U.S.? - Official position : objection to a military expedition without proof and without international approval etc. - Real intention : For oil. Why does Korea send also her soldiers to Iraq ? - Official position : because of friendship with the U. S. and for peace in the World. - Real intention : For fear of the withdrawl of American troops in KoreaA and with a hope to get some economical profits. Politics are disgusting.... I'm afraid you're giving Bush too much credit. We're not pumping any significant oil out of Iraq, we can't even protect the facilities effectively. Bush's Iraq policy is an ill-thought-out improvization (as each rationale withers away) which might end up with a democratically mandated (and morally unassailable, according to Bush's pro-democracy pablum) tightening of relations between Iran and Iraq. Keeping Iran and Iraq estranged has been a keystone of U.S. and European foreign policy for decades. Bush's post 9-11 Crusade may end up being totally counterproductive to "Western" interests.
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Post by seven stars on Feb 15, 2005 10:28:33 GMT -5
Forgive me an emotional rant...
One of the strengths of the democratic model is the ability of the people to have a collective voice(s). In theory, this aspect of our government should serve to hold its leaders accountable. In the context of our current situation, this component of democracy has failed in the U.S.. I say this because of the fact that this nation is divided as it may never have been before. So today, with regard to certain issues, the sentiments of nearly half of the population have been, are, and will be disregarded by our leadership.
Unfortunately the leadership of the U.S. is experiencing power without true accountability, combined with shortsighted decision making. It is frightening to me as an American to consider this. How much more for someone living outside of the U.S. imperium.
Where is the wise counsel that we see in these epic tales of literature and film. Wang Guhn had Tepyoung and Choi Ung, Kyun Hwon had Choi Seung Woo, Cao Cao had Guo Jia and Jia Xu, Liu Bei had Kong Ming. In AOW, the political dilemma may have been precipitated by the lack of such figures. In light of Generaldu's last post, one cannot help but consider the obvious lack counsel and foresight in our current "regime".
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generaldu
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Post by generaldu on Feb 15, 2005 11:01:06 GMT -5
We've been through worse chapters before so keep a calm head, seven stars. Voters have allowed the media to hypnotize them with false issues but there will eventually be an awakening.
I'll offer the familiar quote from my favorite right wing colonialist (even leftists need heroes).
"Democracy is the worst form of government except for all those others that have been tried." - Sir Winston Churchill
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Post by MasterCrabby on Feb 15, 2005 11:59:53 GMT -5
Florel hit the nail on the head. Governments are entities which ideally act in the interests of their own countries and their people. Friendships between governments per se are an illusion of convenience to facilitate support for policies. I am concerned that when people insist on the conformity of reality to fit these contrived concepts of governmental entity that we may lose our opportunities to make improvements in life for the people involved.
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generaldu
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Post by generaldu on Feb 15, 2005 13:02:03 GMT -5
My concern is the possibility that governments and the traditional "watchdog" media are being co-opted by international corporate structures that have no public accountability at all.
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Post by seven stars on Feb 15, 2005 13:30:17 GMT -5
Phew... Thanks Generaldu. Glad someone was there to "talk me off the ledge" . [Playful humor I assure you!]. Isn't it legitimate to hold our own nation to a higher standard than to simply say "take care of your own"? I think that it is, particularly in light of the fact that the U.S. is the most powerful nation in history? I suppose your response would hinge on how you would answer this question: What is the responsibility that comes with power? Is it merely a reponsibility to ones self and ones home, or is it a greater responsibility to community? And, if it is greater, how far does that go?
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generaldu
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Post by generaldu on Feb 15, 2005 13:39:31 GMT -5
I don't think any nation has ever had a higher responsibility to the world than the U.S. does at this juncture of history, with our unprecedented supremacy in military and economic power.
That is why it is so distressing that our society is currently led (in many cultural areas, not just politics) by such mediocre, small-minded drones.
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Post by seven stars on Feb 15, 2005 13:52:40 GMT -5
My concern is the possibility that governments and the traditional "watchdog" media are being co-opted by international corporate structures that have no public accountability at all. So, you pose the possibility that these "drones" are being swayed, or even led primarily by corporate interests rather than civic duty?
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Post by MasterCrabby on Feb 15, 2005 14:09:19 GMT -5
Not to be a killjoy, but the US government has compiled a staggering debt, leaving our options at the grace of creditors. World leadership hinges upon an ever increasing borrowing spree, which threatens internal stability in coming years. External flexibility could be constrained if the confidence of our credit continues to erode. Past world powers have become such often out of going broke.
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generaldu
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Post by generaldu on Feb 15, 2005 14:17:24 GMT -5
But a broke and declining U.S. would still be a juggernaut.
Remember, even the collective illegal drug habits of the U.S population drive the economies of several nations.
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Post by MasterCrabby on Feb 15, 2005 14:50:50 GMT -5
Wouldn't you think it an embarrassment to have, with benefit of an educated assessment of history's pitfalls, squandered perhaps the greatest opportunity to advance the well being of humankind? To be reduced to a medium for gambling, drugs, and sex trades would be a towering insult to the many of our ancestors who had the presence of self worth to devote themselves to worthy works. Don't you think we should reflect on what it is we are promoting "freedom and liberty" towards?
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