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Post by luvarchfiend on Jun 25, 2004 22:00:13 GMT -5
ice tiger you made some good points. it was like the master was talking out of both sides of his mouth. he would say just enough to confuse the archfiend. leave him when he needed him the most.
i had mentioned before that i thought of the archfiend's problem was his lack of education and humble beginnings. he was ill-prepared for what was being asked of him. his fighting skills and bravery weren't the only traits and qualities he needed to be successful in the quest for the imperial dragon cause. he really never had a chance of being successful when left so much on his own.
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Post by Chung Kyun on Jun 25, 2004 22:13:23 GMT -5
ice tiger you made some good points. it was like the master was talking out of both sides of his mouth. he would say just enough to confuse the archfiend. leave him when he needed him the most. i had mentioned before that i thought of the archfiend's problem was his lack of education and humble beginnings. he was ill-prepared for what was being asked of him. his fighting skills and bravery weren't the only traits and qualities he needed to be successful in the quest for the imperial dragon cause. he really never had a chance of being successful when left so much on his own. yes but mostly s he wasn't a natural good guy. he was bad and master is doing and saying things that have changed ui-min.so uimin feels pain but at the same time he just keeps killing. to show his power. its like son2 he is evil, but when he hangs out with his girlfriend, he acts good. even duduel said ui-min is a sleeping dragon that when he wakes up he is a monster. its his true colors being bad. so duduel did help, it made ui-min a better person but it also urt his ego. as back then ui-min was bad but calm, now he is bad and his ego is huge. so it goes both ways for him. ui-min knows duduel since he was a child. so thats why ui-min respects duduel.
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Post by luvarchfiend on Jun 25, 2004 22:22:45 GMT -5
yes but mostly s he wasn't a natural good guy. he was bad and master is doing and saying things that have changed ui-min.so uimin feels pain but at the same time he just keeps killing. to show his power. its like son2 he is evil, but when he hangs out with his girlfriend, he acts good. even duduel said ui-min is a sleeping dragon that when he wakes up he is a monster. its his true colors being bad. so duduel did help, it made ui-min a better person but it also urt his ego. as back then ui-min was bad but calm, now he is bad and his ego is huge. so it goes both ways for him. ui-min knows duduel since he was a child. so thats why ui-min respects duduel. i agree he wasn't a natural good guy. i think he wanted to be at times, and tried to be at times, but didn't know how to do it and sustain it. the more power he aquired the more confused he got and the more complacent. and the point about him respecting the master is one i was trying to make in an earlier post.....that only the master and bu-yong had his trust enough to be influenced by them, when they weren't around he only had himself (he thought) and his inner demons. not a good combination for sustaining the fight for the cause.
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Post by TheIceTiger on Jun 25, 2004 23:15:37 GMT -5
Well i'll try to express my view with shorter passage this time, hope u guys didnt had a hard time reading through my passage which had full of spelling errors and grammar errors. Anyway, i think that the archfiend get crarry away in his achivement is understandable. Afterall, he is born as a lowerly son of a salt merchant. He was one of the first lower class ppl who earned the superior general post. And now after all the hardworks and lost of lives, hes finally imperial guardian. The highest minister of all and 2nd only to the emperor. Why wouldnt he be carry away.Remember the first time he enters a gehsia house, he never even been through one. he had never enjoyed the wealth that he had now, not even when he was superor general or claiming to be the new emperor in the north. There were no ppl sendinghim gifts and for the first time everyone praised him instead of hating him for his murder of the deposed emperor. I think anyone here can get carry away in his positition. The fact that bu-yon departure and the present of Aryan,and the increasing influence by his 2 other sons leads to another explosion of the archfiend anger. He blames Bu young for leaving him and master dudeul for abandoning him. These are the only ppl he trusted, and so im getting a feeling that he is like a little kid. Doing all the wrong things he can maybe just to get attention. What surprise me is that even though he know that the things he is doing is despictable like he said and it's totaly against that dudeul and bu yong believe in, he still do it. Maybe he knows that only then will dudeul and bu young might once again reappear to him like they did in the past. What i really dun understand is that why didn master dudeul keep telling him that" this is wrong, and it'll lead to your doom u fool" instead of just stop with the criticism and start telling that " look we cant change the past, but the future is at our hands, its not too late to achieve the imerpial dragon dream, you just have to do this and that" Things would work out much better for the archfiend because he will do exactly what the master said because he trusts him. Im just feel sorry for the archfiend. Maybe master dudeul compares him with KDS too much. KDS can just figure out what to do even though the master give him some hidden or blind advices. Somehow master deudeul expect the samething from the archfiend
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Post by TheIceTiger on Jun 25, 2004 23:19:11 GMT -5
eh sry it came out longer than i thought. Too much mumbo jumbo from me
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Post by Eowyn on Jun 26, 2004 5:06:59 GMT -5
It's not mumbo jumbo, IceTiger. You all made very discerning observations.
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Post by Chung Kyun on Jun 26, 2004 11:31:52 GMT -5
Well i'll try to express my view with shorter passage this time, hope u guys didnt had a hard time reading through my passage which had full of spelling errors and grammar errors. Anyway, i think that the archfiend get crarry away in his achivement is understandable. Afterall, he is born as a lowerly son of a salt merchant. He was one of the first lower class ppl who earned the superior general post. And now after all the hardworks and lost of lives, hes finally imperial guardian. The highest minister of all and 2nd only to the emperor. Why wouldnt he be carry away.Remember the first time he enters a gehsia house, he never even been through one. he had never enjoyed the wealth that he had now, not even when he was superor general or claiming to be the new emperor in the north. There were no ppl sendinghim gifts and for the first time everyone praised him instead of hating him for his murder of the deposed emperor. I think anyone here can get carry away in his positition. The fact that bu-yon departure and the present of Aryan,and the increasing influence by his 2 other sons leads to another explosion of the archfiend anger. He blames Bu young for leaving him and master dudeul for abandoning him. These are the only ppl he trusted, and so im getting a feeling that he is like a little kid. Doing all the wrong things he can maybe just to get attention. What surprise me is that even though he know that the things he is doing is despictable like he said and it's totaly against that dudeul and bu yong believe in, he still do it. Maybe he knows that only then will dudeul and bu young might once again reappear to him like they did in the past. What i really dun understand is that why didn master dudeul keep telling him that" this is wrong, and it'll lead to your doom u fool" instead of just stop with the criticism and start telling that " look we cant change the past, but the future is at our hands, its not too late to achieve the imerpial dragon dream, you just have to do this and that" Things would work out much better for the archfiend because he will do exactly what the master said because he trusts him. Im just feel sorry for the archfiend. Maybe master dudeul compares him with KDS too much. KDS can just figure out what to do even though the master give him some hidden or blind advices. Somehow master deudeul expect the samething from the archfiend well i guess then, ui-min is doomed anyways. because if he needs duduel and bu-young all the time and they die. ui-min would just become a tyrant again. so the people will hate him anyways. because with out them he is lost.
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Post by luvarchfiend on Jun 26, 2004 11:37:08 GMT -5
well i guess then, ui-min is doomed anyways. because if he needs duduel and bu-young all the time and they die. ui-min would just become a tyrant again. so the people will hate him anyways. because with out them he is lost. maybe not. perhaps if he had time with them, guiding him and showing him the right way, perhaps if something then happened to them, he would have an idea of what he was supposed to do, and how to go about accomplishing what he needed to for the people and shilla.
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Post by Chung Kyun on Jun 26, 2004 12:46:45 GMT -5
maybe not. perhaps if he had time with them, guiding him and showing him the right way, perhaps if something then happened to them, he would have an idea of what he was supposed to do, and how to go about accomplishing what he needed to for the people and shilla. i think he will still be lost. he should know that, killing the people ain't the right thing, you don't have to be smart to know that. giving them food and makeing more jobs will help them. its not hard to know. even tyrants know that, but they just don't feel like helping the people.
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Post by luvarchfiend on Jun 26, 2004 14:01:57 GMT -5
i think he will still be lost. he should know that, killing the people ain't the right thing, you don't have to be smart to know that. giving them food and makeing more jobs will help them. its not hard to know. even tyrants know that, but they just don't feel like helping the people. good points all. but, when you are filled with self-doubt, self-loathing, anger, and the need to prove something, and the only trait or great skill you have is being a warrior, i think there would be a tendency to go with what you know best.
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Post by TheIceTiger on Jun 26, 2004 14:16:42 GMT -5
I think that if someone can make Archfiend have the Heart to save the ppl from distress, then he dont need Bu yong and master duduel. So far, ppl only "convince" him to do it, and that wears off after awhile when nothing happens. Archfiend needs the heart of saving the ppl like KDS did. If you have the heart, the worst thing that can come out is losing your own life for the ppl like KDS did(althought his death was partly becuz of the emperor but he goes against emperor order sometime becuz of the ppl).
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Post by luvarchfiend on Jun 26, 2004 14:27:01 GMT -5
I think that if someone can make Archfiend have the Heart to save the ppl from distress, then he dont need Bu yong and master duduel. So far, ppl only "convince" him to do it, and that wears off after awhile when nothing happens. Archfiend needs the heart of saving the ppl like KDS did. If you have the heart, the worst thing that can come out is losing your own life for the ppl like KDS did(althought his death was partly becuz of the emperor but he goes against emperor order sometime becuz of the ppl). yes its true, he didn't have the heart to do what was best. i still think he could have changed with constant and unwaivering help and guidance. we are all capable of change, even against one's own nature, but it requires help and the intense desire of oneself to do so. maybe he didn't want to change enough to make it happen.
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Post by Eowyn on Jun 27, 2004 6:51:20 GMT -5
Archfiend needs the heart of saving the ppl like KDS did. Ooh, you put that so well, IceTiger.
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Post by luvarchfiend on Jun 27, 2004 14:00:39 GMT -5
the heart of KDS, the drive, will and fearlessness of the archfiend.....what a combination that would have been. that person would have succeeded in the quest for the cause.
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ArchFiend 4 life
Junior Addict
"Your Grace is Immeasurable"-every suboordinate in AoW
Posts: 187
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Post by ArchFiend 4 life on Jun 29, 2004 13:36:32 GMT -5
Dont forget to mention this luvarchfiend KDS's Dobang team up with The Archfiends Imperial Dragon Army Led by Kim Sami.. wow I still believe that the producers should have altered History a little bit and make this exist! But....I guess they have to be accurate in their depiction of Korean HIstory.
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